Loading music in ZX Spectrum games.

edited February 2009 in Games
I've always wondered, did any ZX Spectrum games feature AY 3 -8912 loading music (I'm not aware of any) or was this a technical impossibility on the Spectrum? (I assume that the loading tones could not be disabled from reaching the TV Speaker/Beeper). Apparently, there are a few Amstrad CPC games which did this and of course the C64 could achieve this (still not sure how - some form of interrrupt driven routines?).

I've found this video on You Tube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rByIgi65xZk

...which apparently mixes music tones with sine wave data but it could be a fake.

Regards, Andrew
Post edited by alaggan on

Comments

  • edited October 2008
    Very interesting, if not fake of course.
    I never see something like this before, actually looks like all things workin on 48K model. :)
    Probably sound chip can do that, like SID in C64, but if this effects really can be achieved on my favourite 48K Speccy, thats will be very cool.
  • zx1zx1
    edited October 2008
    Is that possible? Don't remember ever seeing that in any game.
    We must perform a quirkafleeg
  • edited October 2008
    It has been done, actually, check Woody's tape protection thread (I think)
  • edited October 2008
    Its not fake, just very clever I think. Allthough nearly 2 minutes to load a screen!
    I like his loader using the joystick port at 155kbps. Loads Alchemist game and screen in 2 seconds. Methinks its similar to the codemasters cd loader which also used the joystick port.
    WIP Tritone Demo
    No more html on dropbox. :(
  • edited October 2008
    Whether somewhere in wos archive exist game or any example with such a loader, which we can try?
  • edited October 2008
    I remember trying to do this once, I noticed that if you have a line, say

    10 REM vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

    then the loading noise for that will be one long constant note, and different letters/symbols would be different notes. probably not what they've done in that clip though, obviously. and too random to build an actual tune out of...
  • edited October 2008
    Here you can find the original topic in spanish, including the program used to generate the wav file and its source code:
    http://www.speccy.org/foro/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=214
  • edited October 2008
    def chris wrote: »
    I remember trying to do this once, I noticed that if you have a line, say

    10 REM vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

    then the loading noise for that will be one long constant note, and different letters/symbols would be different notes. probably not what they've done in that clip though, obviously. and too random to build an actual tune out of...

    ...you might like this:

    http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=30929

    ...a perfect illustration of what you are reffering to. I remember certain games ('Jasper' and 'Hunchback II' spring to mind) which had quirks in heir loading tones which sounded musical and often humourous :)
  • edited October 2008
    alaggan wrote: »
    ...you might like this:

    http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=30929

    ...a perfect illustration of what you are reffering to. I remember certain games ('Jasper' and 'Hunchback II' spring to mind) which had quirks in heir loading tones which sounded musical and often humourous :)

    nice! so it is possible to make a loading tune that way...I'm guessing that must have taken ages to create, lol
  • edited October 2008
    def chris wrote: »
    I remember trying to do this once, I noticed that if you have a line, say

    10 REM vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

    then the loading noise for that will be one long constant note, and different letters/symbols would be different notes. probably not what they've done in that clip though, obviously. and too random to build an actual tune out of...

    I created a screen$ that played, 'God Save the Queen' as it loaded. Just used different splashes of Bit and Attr data for the effect and hid these in the actual picture so that it wasn't a total mess.
  • edited October 2008
    Metalbrain wrote: »
    Here you can find the original topic in spanish, including the program used to generate the wav file and its source code:
    http://www.speccy.org/foro/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=214

    Great stuff, works fine with Spin, but i have problem to load this wav file into SpecEmu.
    He support this kind of format, but after inserted into tape browser and try to load, nothing happen.
    Of course i choose 48K model, switchin off, all fast load and other tape option (auto load, edge detection etc.), but he refuse to start.
    Any hints?
  • edited October 2008
    Graz wrote: »
    I created a screen$ that played, 'God Save the Queen' as it loaded. Just used different splashes of Bit and Attr data for the effect and hid these in the actual picture so that it wasn't a total mess.

    that should be used for the next royal gathering IMO. lol
  • edited October 2008
    When it came to the CPC games, it seems only Firebird games featured music while loading. C64 games - it was the use of interrupts which allowed music to play while loading.

    I was particually keen on the loader which allowed you to play a game of Space Invaders while loading a game - IIRC, it was the original Activision release of Ghostbusters (C64).
  • edited October 2008
    I know budget label Players did minigames on some of their loaders like the Joe-Blade 2 bomb diffuser and the pac man loader on their Skateboard Construction Kit. The Invade-a-load another poster reffered to was on Mastertronic games and had Rob Hubbards' One Man And His Droid tune playing in the background.
  • edited October 2008
    alaggan wrote: »
    I've always wondered, did any ZX Spectrum games feature AY 3 -8912 loading music or was this a technical impossibility on the Spectrum?

    You may want to check this thread, and especially this, this and this post. It shows that both AY music as well as the music made by the loading sound itself is possible.

    Patrik
  • edited October 2008
    In this thread Woody mentioned several loaders (jsw, laserload, screenload...), but their links not working. Maybe we can find them somewhere else?
    Jet-Story and The Tube is only i can find and work perfect on SpecEmu, only this musicaloader (http://personal.auna.com/casariche/musicaloader.zip) from Spanish forum which Metalbrain mentioned, refuse to load?
    Woody, help! :)
  • edited October 2008
    Patrik Rak wrote: »
    You may want to check this thread, and especially this, this and this post. It shows that both AY music as well as the music made by the loading sound itself is possible.

    Patrik

    Thanks for this, I'm impressed. I can also see now why the architecture of the C64 (with it's custom tape deck) makes it easier to achieve these music loaders.
  • edited October 2008
    Pegaz wrote: »
    In this thread Woody mentioned several loaders (jsw, laserload, screenload...), but their links not working. Maybe we can find them somewhere else?

    Possibly here ;)
    Jet-Story and The Tube is only i can find and work perfect on SpecEmu, only this musicaloader (http://personal.auna.com/casariche/musicaloader.zip) from Spanish forum which Metalbrain mentioned, refuse to load?

    Auto tape problem. Manually start the tape with F11. You might also need to turn auto tape controls off depending on your SpecEmu version.
  • edited October 2008
    Woody wrote: »
    Possibly here ;)
    Auto tape problem. Manually start the tape with F11. You might also need to turn auto tape controls off depending on your SpecEmu version.

    Thanks Woody for the tip and these great loaders, now everything work fine. :)
  • edited October 2008
    The newer Amstrad ZX Spectrum should be capable with it's bulit in Cassete Recorder - presumably like the CPC and the C64 they built in Stop Start Auto Tape load functionality into it Then again maybe not The CPC played proper C64 style loading music on the BT Firebird range of games but the sound chip wasn't as good as the SID so it presumably wasn't done very often other than a few times.
  • edited October 2008
    If Speccy 48K is capable for those music loaders i dont see why models with sound chip cant do same thing, like many of C64 games.
    Is there any commercial disk or cassete 128K game with playin AY music during the load?
  • edited February 2009
    When it came to the CPC games, it seems only Firebird games featured music while loading. C64 games - it was the use of interrupts which allowed music to play while loading.

    As regards Amstrad CPC games, I've fired up a few .cdt (Tape) images (equivalent to .TZX files apparently) of some Firebird software and as yet have only discovered 'loading music' in one game, 'The Wild Bunch' which was the equivalent of a few beeps which seemed to play between loading blocks (in a similar way to many Mastertronic games did on the Spectrum - 'Finders Keepers' etc.) I'm intruiged to see if the Amstrad could do this...
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