It's pretty straightforward to recode the keyboard input to a game. I showed someone how to redefine the keys for Horace And The Spiders in another thread.
Try looking in ZX Shed issue 3 for my article on keyboard input for more help.
Incidently the worst was the early Ultimate games. QWERT was just a nightmare to control, the rotating ones as well were particulary annoying. Nomad comes to mind.
death star interceptor with QAOPM, Q driving your ship DOWNwards and A UPwards managed to be pretty awkward, especially in the second stage. :)
(special bonus in this contest, as a joystick doesn´t help you with the inverted up-down controls).
btw - does anybody know, where comes the largely spectrum-specific key configuration QAOPM from?
If a certain game has qzipm as the only keys available and no optional controls, isn't it possible to make the emulated spectrum 'think' that you're using those keys, when you're in fact using your defined keys? For example, pressing 'a' would be detected by the emulated spectrum as if you were pressing z (down). If this kind of redefinition is possible, our problems would be solved, at least for emulator users.
yes, emuzwin allows you to remap keys freely, spin offers the function "keystick" which makes the same for up to 5 keys, actually.
My daft mate, who always re-defined the keys to L=Left, R=Right, etc... Then looking down, searching the keyboard everytime he wanted do something, then back up to the screen, only to find out that he'd died about 30 seconds ago. :D:D:D
death star interceptor with QAOPM, Q driving your ship DOWNwards and A UPwards managed to be pretty awkward, especially in the second stage. :)
(special bonus in this contest, as a joystick doesn?t help you with the inverted up-down controls).
btw - does anybody know, where comes the largely spectrum-specific key configuration QAOPM from?
I always use inverted up down controls for flight. I really hate modern shooters with reversed sniper scope controls though. That bugs me.
Actually, I always used the AGF/Cursor joystick option when I did not know the keys of a game; I even redefined the keys according to that pattern whenever possible. It seems I was the only Spectrum user I am aware of to do so.
Really?! I know that many, like me, handled both Sinclairs quite easily, but the AGF... dear Gods...
And wait, there's even worse, I can think of a beat'em game with 8 keys for each direction, laid out in a circle. CRAP
You don't have to. It was the infamous Way Of The Exploding Fist.
And many others: huh... no. I think you are not only wrong, you are also being completely unfair for several reasons:
a) The game keys were redefinable.
b) The game could be played with the normal 4F (directions + fire) combination
c) The complete set of keys (if you can be bothered to actually redefine them all, which I can't TBH) grants you the possibility to attach a specific attack with a single key, extremely useful if you play with the 4F standard and get a single key to get that otherwise 2 or 3 key combination manouvre to work at the right time. :D
I find AGF, reversed up/down keys and hidden key layouts (like SAM cruise) the worst
My nomination for the worst controls are the Crystal Computing / Design Design games; all over the keyboard with seemingly little sense to them. Halls of the Things was probably the worst of the lot.
That said, they got so hacked off with all the bad reviews they copped for their keyboard choices that they put the ultimate in redefinable key systems into their games starting from Dark Star.
As for the QAOPM combination, the first game I can think of that used it was Penetrator. Any advances on that?
I always loved using the cursor keys, or the keyboard equivalents of the two Sinclair joysticks - it meant I could play any game without having to know their particular arrangement of keys. QZIPM was my personal bug-bear - never could get used to that, and although I had a Kempston joystick, I found that I preferred keys to it for all but shooters. Personal fave was ZXKML though.
As for the QAOPM combination, the first game I can think of that used it was Penetrator. Any advances on that?
I think it came about just because someone decided to look into the most confortable combination of keys. In fact, this was the one (in 48K, in a pc, M becomes the space bar). Sometimes, people with long fingers chose QZIPN instead. :D
Nowadays, for some freaking reason, in the PC, they become WSADControl...
As for the QAOPM combination, the first game I can think of that used it was Penetrator. Any advances on that?
i also had such a hypothesis, it was invented by penetrator's author Philip Mitchell, which could be explained, as in the first version of penetrator at TRS80, you already use the same key for rockets and speed-up, but this key is the right cursor arrow there. it´s very incomfortable as it´s difficult to drive up and down with a finger of the same hand by wich you quickly press the right arrow repeatedly to shoot rockets. with this multifunctional right-key, the combination QAOPM demanding both hands for the four directions is a perfect solution and zx-penetrator can be controlled very well with it.
afaik, at the other 8-bit comps, the cursor keys-like combination served by one hand prevailed for the movement control (which is continued by wasd). (am i right with the other computers?) so, i thought mitchell could be responsible for this spectrum particularity (which i would find great, if this first-class classics would be determining also in this respect). but when i checked earlier games, i believed i found many (quite unknown, today) games using it already before (i don´t remember them, now :) ).
that's horrific. especially as you can define a standard 5-key set up such as QAOPspace and not lose anything.
aside from the usual suspects...
Quazatron. A Z L M enter. GASH!
Horace Goes Skiing Q Z I P. why not just QAOP? mongs.
Transformers. 12345 or 67890. grrr....
the controls with numbers whasnt something to do with the sinclair joystick? when my joystick got ruined(thank you super test...) I started playing with the numbers...and was actually really good at it (specially playing emelyn hughes!)
I had a cousin who only uses QAOPZ (z for fire drived me mad...)
also footballer of the year used an inverted QAOP ?space?, If I'm not mistaked it was PLQW ?space?...it always takes me a while to get in to it...
I got really used to the speccy cursor key arrangement, so if possible I would always used 5678 and 0 in games.
I even find myself redefining keys in some pc/mac games to match that arrangment.
I got really used to the speccy cursor key arrangement, so if possible I would always used 5678 and 0 in games.
I even find myself redefining keys in some pc/mac games to match that arrangment.
ye, i can understand this, suffernig always when i canot set the keys to qaopm(space) on pc, especially in horizontally scrolling shooters :smile:
my fave layout was QAKLJ. I started with QAOPspace, but my spacebar stopped working properly on my Spectrum + so I went to QAOPM, but O and P started getting rubbish, so then it was QANMB, B went, then settled on QAKLJ.
My mate got a +2 that came with an absolute mountain of games across 10 or 20 tapes...the majority was a load of old Quicksilva/Argus Press type stuff, along with random bits like Knot in 3d, Lothlorien arcade games and such...
Really can't remember the name of the game, but amongst that lot was some sort of space arcade game and the controls were...
U=UP
D=DOWN
L=LEFT
R=RIGHT
F=FIRE
I might be wrong on the F, but everything else was like that. Don't believe there was any other way of playing the game either.
As I recall, the use of QWERT (Ultimate games) and 67890 (Timegate amongst others) was code optimisation. The Speccy divides the keyboard into eight zones each associated with a single port - so by reducing the keyboard polling to a single one, the game will run faster and more memory is available.
Correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a looong time since I did any Z80.
As I recall, the use of QWERT (Ultimate games) and 67890 (Timegate amongst others) was code optimisation. The Speccy divides the keyboard into eight zones each associated with a single port - so by reducing the keyboard polling to a single one, the game will run faster and more memory is available.
Correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a looong time since I did any Z80.
You are correct, hardly a reason though to make a game so bloody awkward to play.
You are correct, hardly a reason though to make a game so bloody awkward to play.
The cycles and memory saved is negligible. We are talking 0.000000000001% of execution time and a couple dozen bytes. So it was mainly programmer laziness.
The cycles and memory saved is negligible. We are talking 0.000000000001% of execution time and a couple dozen bytes. So it was mainly programmer laziness.
Without stirring up a hornets nest here, the Stamper Bros used the QWERT system, and they can hardly be accused of programmer laziness. Can they?:???:
C'mon you guys haven't even been trying! How about one of my favourite two player games from the day, Games Workshop's Battlecars that requires 14 keys per player in a two-player game! Diabolical keys, but I loved the game.
A. The Keyboard Layout
Each Battlecar has six steering functions, four 'fire' functions, throttle and brakes; so we've included a pair of keyboard overlays. These fit the two ends of the keyboard - so the top row of keys of each overlay is (left) 1 2 3 4 and (right) 7 8 9 0 respectively. You will see from the overlay that the steering keys are (L) Q 1 2 3 4 R and (R) U 7 8 9 0 P.
The Steering keys work this way:
Q and U - 90 degrees turn to the left
1 and 7 - 45 degrees turn to the left
2 and 8 - drift to the left
3 and 9 - drift to the right
4 and 0 - 45 degrees turn to the right
R and P - 90 degrees turn to the right
Each car has four 'fire' buttons - one for 'missile' weapons - submachine guns, shells, missiles, flames and lasers, and three for the 'passive' weapons - oil, spikes, mines and smoke. The three 'passive' weapon buttons control the left, right and rear pods:
A and J - left weapon pod
S and K - right weapon pod
Z and M - rear weapon pod
The 'missile' weapon button is marked 'FIRE' and controls the forward-firing pods in all cars, and the rear-firing pods in large-chassis cars:
W and I - missile pods
'Missile' weapons will fire towards the enemy car providing it is in 'front' of your own - you will find that 'in front' means anywhere in a 180 degree field in front of the driver. If the enemy car is behind you, you will not be able to fire at it unless you have rear missile pods (only large-chassis cars have them) in which case the missile weapons will fire backwards
towards the enemy car.
Each car has a throttle and a brake:
E and O - throttle
D and L - brake
These are the main control keys.
In addition, each time you start a game you will be given a 'READY' signal. To indicate that you are 'STEADY', press C for the left hand car and B for the right hand car. You will then be given a GO signal. If you press your throttle before the GO signal comes up, you will have to start again, by pressing your 'STEADY' key.
In the bottom corners of the screen are the DAMAGE DISPLAYS (DDs). When you are playing the game, the DD will change to a WEAPON DISPLAY (WD) and back again, each time you fire or are hit. You can manually change it to the other display by pressing X (left car) or N (right car).
CAPS SHIFT and 6 (together) stops a game. C restarts it with the same cars. Any other key takes you back to the menu.
Without stirring up a hornets nest here, the Stamper Bros used the QWERT system, and they can hardly be accused of programmer laziness. Can they?:???:
Well in a way, but it is more of a flaw at the design stage. Once you have got used to a system yourself it is hard to imagine someone coming at it anew.
I hated the QWERT system, and used cursor/kempston/sinclair joystick selection just so I could use the numbers instead.
Just for the sake of a redefine keys option I could have played with qazxc ( my preferred ).
Without stirring up a hornets nest here, the Stamper Bros used the QWERT system, and they can hardly be accused of programmer laziness. Can they?:???:
Heh heh. That's exactly what I am saying. How could anyone release a game that is so hard to use that it's nearly unplayable without a joystick? Did they actually have someone else try to play it?
Anyway, try poking this into Sabre Wulf at address $b0b1 just after the game loads and the program is waiting for a keypress on the loading screen (all hex values):
This code replaces the Interface II controls with QAOPM. Not only that, this routine can support user defined keys and is shorter than the Interface II code the Stamper brothers wrote. Since the keys can be redefined this single routine can support the keyboard QWERT, cursor joystick and interface II for which the Stamper brothers wrote three separate routines.
It took me about 2 minutes to locate the key reading routines in Sabre Wulf, 4 minutes to write this routine and about 10 to hand assemble it and poke it in the emulator.
Anyone remember Rally Driver? It had about 30 different keys and it was very jerky. Also Hard Drivin' was hard to control - so was Toyota Celica GT Rally.
Comments
Try looking in ZX Shed issue 3 for my article on keyboard input for more help.
Incidently the worst was the early Ultimate games. QWERT was just a nightmare to control, the rotating ones as well were particulary annoying. Nomad comes to mind.
(special bonus in this contest, as a joystick doesn´t help you with the inverted up-down controls).
btw - does anybody know, where comes the largely spectrum-specific key configuration QAOPM from?
yes, emuzwin allows you to remap keys freely, spin offers the function "keystick" which makes the same for up to 5 keys, actually.
I always use inverted up down controls for flight. I really hate modern shooters with reversed sniper scope controls though. That bugs me.
Really?! I know that many, like me, handled both Sinclairs quite easily, but the AGF... dear Gods...
And many others: huh... no. I think you are not only wrong, you are also being completely unfair for several reasons:
a) The game keys were redefinable.
b) The game could be played with the normal 4F (directions + fire) combination
c) The complete set of keys (if you can be bothered to actually redefine them all, which I can't TBH) grants you the possibility to attach a specific attack with a single key, extremely useful if you play with the 4F standard and get a single key to get that otherwise 2 or 3 key combination manouvre to work at the right time. :D
I find AGF, reversed up/down keys and hidden key layouts (like SAM cruise) the worst
That said, they got so hacked off with all the bad reviews they copped for their keyboard choices that they put the ultimate in redefinable key systems into their games starting from Dark Star.
As for the QAOPM combination, the first game I can think of that used it was Penetrator. Any advances on that?
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I think it came about just because someone decided to look into the most confortable combination of keys. In fact, this was the one (in 48K, in a pc, M becomes the space bar). Sometimes, people with long fingers chose QZIPN instead. :D
Nowadays, for some freaking reason, in the PC, they become WSADControl...
i also had such a hypothesis, it was invented by penetrator's author Philip Mitchell, which could be explained, as in the first version of penetrator at TRS80, you already use the same key for rockets and speed-up, but this key is the right cursor arrow there. it´s very incomfortable as it´s difficult to drive up and down with a finger of the same hand by wich you quickly press the right arrow repeatedly to shoot rockets. with this multifunctional right-key, the combination QAOPM demanding both hands for the four directions is a perfect solution and zx-penetrator can be controlled very well with it.
afaik, at the other 8-bit comps, the cursor keys-like combination served by one hand prevailed for the movement control (which is continued by wasd). (am i right with the other computers?) so, i thought mitchell could be responsible for this spectrum particularity (which i would find great, if this first-class classics would be determining also in this respect). but when i checked earlier games, i believed i found many (quite unknown, today) games using it already before (i don´t remember them, now :) ).
that's horrific. especially as you can define a standard 5-key set up such as QAOPspace and not lose anything.
aside from the usual suspects...
Quazatron. A Z L M enter. GASH!
Horace Goes Skiing Q Z I P. why not just QAOP? mongs.
Transformers. 12345 or 67890. grrr....
the controls with numbers whasnt something to do with the sinclair joystick? when my joystick got ruined(thank you super test...) I started playing with the numbers...and was actually really good at it (specially playing emelyn hughes!)
I had a cousin who only uses QAOPZ (z for fire drived me mad...)
also footballer of the year used an inverted QAOP ?space?, If I'm not mistaked it was PLQW ?space?...it always takes me a while to get in to it...
I even find myself redefining keys in some pc/mac games to match that arrangment.
ye, i can understand this, suffernig always when i canot set the keys to qaopm(space) on pc, especially in horizontally scrolling shooters :smile:
Really can't remember the name of the game, but amongst that lot was some sort of space arcade game and the controls were...
U=UP
D=DOWN
L=LEFT
R=RIGHT
F=FIRE
I might be wrong on the F, but everything else was like that. Don't believe there was any other way of playing the game either.
THAT game gets my vote, hands down!
Correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a looong time since I did any Z80.
The cycles and memory saved is negligible. We are talking 0.000000000001% of execution time and a couple dozen bytes. So it was mainly programmer laziness.
Write games in C using Z88DK and SP1
S.A.S. Operation Thunderflash
A fairly decent looking game, with a seemingly straight forward objective...
Well try and get past the first screen with the controls provided. Then check out the enemy AI, then check out the depth of gameplay...
Then just go back to playing Green Beret or something...
;-)
Without stirring up a hornets nest here, the Stamper Bros used the QWERT system, and they can hardly be accused of programmer laziness. Can they?:???:
A. The Keyboard Layout
Each Battlecar has six steering functions, four 'fire' functions, throttle and brakes; so we've included a pair of keyboard overlays. These fit the two ends of the keyboard - so the top row of keys of each overlay is (left) 1 2 3 4 and (right) 7 8 9 0 respectively. You will see from the overlay that the steering keys are (L) Q 1 2 3 4 R and (R) U 7 8 9 0 P.
The Steering keys work this way:
Q and U - 90 degrees turn to the left
1 and 7 - 45 degrees turn to the left
2 and 8 - drift to the left
3 and 9 - drift to the right
4 and 0 - 45 degrees turn to the right
R and P - 90 degrees turn to the right
Each car has four 'fire' buttons - one for 'missile' weapons - submachine guns, shells, missiles, flames and lasers, and three for the 'passive' weapons - oil, spikes, mines and smoke. The three 'passive' weapon buttons control the left, right and rear pods:
A and J - left weapon pod
S and K - right weapon pod
Z and M - rear weapon pod
The 'missile' weapon button is marked 'FIRE' and controls the forward-firing pods in all cars, and the rear-firing pods in large-chassis cars:
W and I - missile pods
'Missile' weapons will fire towards the enemy car providing it is in 'front' of your own - you will find that 'in front' means anywhere in a 180 degree field in front of the driver. If the enemy car is behind you, you will not be able to fire at it unless you have rear missile pods (only large-chassis cars have them) in which case the missile weapons will fire backwards
towards the enemy car.
Each car has a throttle and a brake:
E and O - throttle
D and L - brake
These are the main control keys.
In addition, each time you start a game you will be given a 'READY' signal. To indicate that you are 'STEADY', press C for the left hand car and B for the right hand car. You will then be given a GO signal. If you press your throttle before the GO signal comes up, you will have to start again, by pressing your 'STEADY' key.
In the bottom corners of the screen are the DAMAGE DISPLAYS (DDs). When you are playing the game, the DD will change to a WEAPON DISPLAY (WD) and back again, each time you fire or are hit. You can manually change it to the other display by pressing X (left car) or N (right car).
CAPS SHIFT and 6 (together) stops a game. C restarts it with the same cars. Any other key takes you back to the menu.
Well in a way, but it is more of a flaw at the design stage. Once you have got used to a system yourself it is hard to imagine someone coming at it anew.
I hated the QWERT system, and used cursor/kempston/sinclair joystick selection just so I could use the numbers instead.
Just for the sake of a redefine keys option I could have played with qazxc ( my preferred ).
Heh heh. That's exactly what I am saying. How could anyone release a game that is so hard to use that it's nearly unplayable without a joystick? Did they actually have someone else try to play it?
Anyway, try poking this into Sabre Wulf at address $b0b1 just after the game loads and the program is waiting for a keypress on the loading screen (all hex values):
And then tell me what you think.
This code replaces the Interface II controls with QAOPM. Not only that, this routine can support user defined keys and is shorter than the Interface II code the Stamper brothers wrote. Since the keys can be redefined this single routine can support the keyboard QWERT, cursor joystick and interface II for which the Stamper brothers wrote three separate routines.
It took me about 2 minutes to locate the key reading routines in Sabre Wulf, 4 minutes to write this routine and about 10 to hand assemble it and poke it in the emulator.
Write games in C using Z88DK and SP1
better than qaop space (or M or SS, whatever) surely not!