Did the Speccy anniversary make it to CNN? No, but Commodore's 25th did.
Gamebase is updated regularly with the ZZAP articles, has a very lively forum (occasionally overwhelmed by spam) with development of Gamebases for other machines, and the offline database is constantly being updated with fixes/changes.
Lemon's forum is also really busy, with news of new developments, games, and so on. There are still lots of things happening for the C64.
Merman ... hmmm ... that's m-e-r-m-a-n, right? Well ... that's another one in The Big Black Book of C-64 Shame.
Not necessarily that; I've been to both sites quite a bit in the recent weeks, for the "also published on the C64" section of those new MIA entries. :-)
I wouldn't necessarily say the Spectrum is more loved than the C64 - GameBase64 did a new ISO last year with more games added to the collection and Lemon64 has recently appointed a new admin and forum activity is still as busy as ever.
Okay, I'll grant one update in an entire year.
We seem to out-pace forum posts per day, though, so I still reckon the Speccy is more loved right now.
Did the Speccy anniversary make it to CNN? No, but Commodore's 25th did.
Gamebase is updated regularly with the ZZAP articles, has a very lively forum (occasionally overwhelmed by spam) with development of Gamebases for other machines, and the offline database is constantly being updated with fixes/changes.
Lemon's forum is also really busy, with news of new developments, games, and so on. There are still lots of things happening for the C64.
we know theres things happening on the commode front, we never said it was dead
however
is there MORE happening than the speccy scene thats the thing
and it really does baffle me as there DOESNT seem to be a site like wos that ries to archive EVERYTHING ever released for the commode 64 (games, inlays, mags etc as well as a neat little forum full of idiots like h.........errrrm)
Professional Mel-the-Bell Simulator................"So realistic, I found myself reaching for the Kleenex King-Size!" - Richard Darling
Okay, I'll grant one update in an entire year.
We seem to out-pace forum posts per day, though, so I still reckon the Speccy is more loved right now.
When I had the Telegraph interview with David McCandless[1] back in 1997, he asked me why the C64 retroscene was so undeveloped compared to the Speccy scene, and I replied that C64 users didn't seem to care as much about their machine as we do ours.
Plus ca change, eh?
Personally I think the majority[2] of C64 users were attracted to it by its shininess (better sound, more colourful graphics), and then quickly ditched it when something even shinier appeared (consoles, Amiga, ST, etc). Lather, rinse, repeat - the C64 just being a piece of booty to most of them, and so easily discarded when something better came along.
Speccy owners tended to be more than just about the games - you could do more with it out of the box, so you formed a stronger bond with the machine than if it was just a strict games machine, like most C64s were treated as. The bond, missing for most C64 owners, is harder to shake off, hence the larger Speccy retroscene compared to the C64.
And as for the Amstrad...
[1] CLANG!
[2] Not all - if you disagree, then I'm not talking about you.
wos
myspeccy
rzx archive
speccy spoilers
the team going out looking for MIA games
the people still making / selling new games (i know they still make em for the commode, but not as many as the speccy?)
Don't forget the Speccy Tour. I haven't heard of any other systems that has a yearly gaming competition except for MAME Emulators :)
When I had the Telegraph interview with David McCandless[1] back in 1997, he asked me why the C64 retroscene was so undeveloped compared to the Speccy scene, and I replied that C64 users didn't seem to care as much about their machine as we do ours.
Plus ca change, eh?
Personally I think the majority[2] of C64 users were attracted to it by its shininess (better sound, more colourful graphics), and then quickly ditched it when something even shinier appeared (consoles, Amiga, ST, etc). Lather, rinse, repeat - the C64 just being a piece of booty to most of them, and so easily discarded when something better came along.
Speccy owners tended to be more than just about the games - you could do more with it out of the box, so you formed a stronger bond with the machine than if it was just a strict games machine, like most C64s were treated as. The bond, missing for most C64 owners, is harder to shake off, hence the larger Speccy retroscene compared to the C64.
And as for the Amstrad...
[1] CLANG!
[2] Not all - if you disagree, then I'm not talking about you.
Thats a bloody good point there.
I agree, Commodore users were maybee more fickle for a number of reasons.
As you say they were attracted by the colourfull graphics and nice sound and quicky mooved on when somthing better came allong.
C64's cost considerably more than a Spectrum, so the parents were obviously more willing to shell out for their kids than Spectrum owners. Therefore when somthing new came allong they were more likely to get brought it, and subsiquently forgot about the Commodore 64. Thats how it was for a lad I knew. When parents do that a kid fails to appreciate things as much as say a kid that gets nice gifts less frequently.
Maybe because the parents buying a Spectrum tended to be more frugal in nature, it meant that the kids had them for longer than say the C64 kids who had their computers for lesser periods. Thus we had more time to develop an affection for the machine. Even the BBC micro brigade began to gravitate towards the Archamedes in the late 80's.
I also think that parents who's offspring were likely to have nerdish tendancies would have brought, a Spectrum or a BBC Micro. A BBC micro because they could afford it, or a Spectrum because Sir Clive was a bit of a house hold british hero amongst those types of parent back then.
Another factor is that Spectrums remained relitively unchanged since 1982 (all be it a few cheap frills). Other manufacturers were offering superior machines (we'll forget about the QL) to tempt the user wich would of course been promoted in the mags for the relevant machine. With the Spectrum it took MGT to step up to the plate but by the time they did, it was too late.
Now, let's turn the question around: what kinds of things does the C64 scene have that the Speccy scene doesn't?
Well, they do have a quite active game music remixer scene. There are plenty of very good remixes of all those classic tunes, some of which were identical on our speccy as far as the melody is concerned. I'll happily admit I frequently listen to Slay Radio.
Speccy was much easier to program off the bat too than the C64. I used to spend a lot of my time programing my own games and stuff on the speccy which naturally gave you more of a 'connection' with it.
When I got the c64 I barely touched it programming wise...didn't seem user friendly at all so it was just a games machine.
Speccy was much easier to program off the bat too than the C64. I used to spend a lot of my time programing my own games and stuff on the speccy which naturally gave you more of a 'connection' with it.
When I got the c64 I barely touched it programming wise...didn't seem user friendly at all so it was just a games machine.
Yeah you've only got to take one look at an Imput mag to see that. All sorts of weird and wonderfull meaningless uncontextualised characters in its syntax.
The good thing about programming on the early spectrum is that you have a Keyword reference straight infront of you on the keyboard.
From the perspective of a novice programmer the 48K basic was alot less fiddly than other basics. As it centered around ready made keywords the user was less prone to making sytax errors and typos, and could build a program very quickly. Also its system of syntax validation on line entry meant that entered programs only contained logic errors (if you count for without next and variable not found as logic errors). All this coupled with the on key programming references (or reminders), made it a very ideal platform for learning the basics of programming.
Personally I think that if the 48Ks had shipped with the 128K style basic, less kids would have found programming to be accesable on the Spectrum.
Aside from that little diversion, I've seen the claims that the fact that the Spectrum has an "all-in-one" site makes it more-loved. That's just stupid, because it denies the existence of GB64, etc. Lemon has everything that WOS does(minus the downloads, for the most part), but it also has user reviews and a MUCH better rating system. So, I think that the C64 has a better presence on the Internet.
Why is Internet capitalized, anyway? Who trademarked it? Why do I care?
we know theres things happening on the commode front, we never said it was dead
however
is there MORE happening than the speccy scene thats the thing
and it really does baffle me as there DOESNT seem to be a site like wos that ries to archive EVERYTHING ever released for the commode 64 (games, inlays, mags etc as well as a neat little forum full of idiots like h.........errrrm)
The main speccite approach to this thread seems to be that because the content of slayradio, csdb, lemon, protovision, forum64, denial, sfodb, 64ending, c64gtw, HVSC, project64 etc. etc. (was that enough :p) aren't all at the same website then the Commodore scene isn't as big as the ZX scene.
Great theory.
The main speccite approach to this thread seems to be that because the content of slayradio, csdb, lemon, protovision, forum64, denial, sfodb, 64ending, c64gtw, HVSC, project64 etc. etc. (was that enough :p) aren't all at the same website then the Commodore scene isn't as big as the ZX scene.
Great theory.
I'm always impressed by the depth and variation in the Speccy scene.
Now, let's turn the question around: what kinds of things does the C64 scene have that the Speccy scene doesn't?
Even the C64 joystick thingy is matchable now we're getting close to reproducing the Speccy's ULA from scratch. How does a miniturised Speccy sound?
The C64 has a Guitar Hero* game on the way, and already has more than one Dance Dance Revolution game.
Are there MMC/SD interfaces for the Spectrum yet?
IDE hard drives?
*One clever bit with this is the interface, taking any Playstation peripheral and mapping the inputs to a standard 9-pin joystick plug. May need a bit of rewiring for Spectrum, though.
Comments
Merman ... hmmm ... that's m-e-r-m-a-n, right? Well ... that's another one in The Big Black Book of C-64 Shame.
Not necessarily that; I've been to both sites quite a bit in the recent weeks, for the "also published on the C64" section of those new MIA entries. :-)
Okay, I'll grant one update in an entire year.
We seem to out-pace forum posts per day, though, so I still reckon the Speccy is more loved right now.
we know theres things happening on the commode front, we never said it was dead
however
is there MORE happening than the speccy scene thats the thing
and it really does baffle me as there DOESNT seem to be a site like wos that ries to archive EVERYTHING ever released for the commode 64 (games, inlays, mags etc as well as a neat little forum full of idiots like h.........errrrm)
When I had the Telegraph interview with David McCandless[1] back in 1997, he asked me why the C64 retroscene was so undeveloped compared to the Speccy scene, and I replied that C64 users didn't seem to care as much about their machine as we do ours.
Plus ca change, eh?
Personally I think the majority[2] of C64 users were attracted to it by its shininess (better sound, more colourful graphics), and then quickly ditched it when something even shinier appeared (consoles, Amiga, ST, etc). Lather, rinse, repeat - the C64 just being a piece of booty to most of them, and so easily discarded when something better came along.
Speccy owners tended to be more than just about the games - you could do more with it out of the box, so you formed a stronger bond with the machine than if it was just a strict games machine, like most C64s were treated as. The bond, missing for most C64 owners, is harder to shake off, hence the larger Speccy retroscene compared to the C64.
And as for the Amstrad...
[1] CLANG!
[2] Not all - if you disagree, then I'm not talking about you.
Don't forget the Speccy Tour. I haven't heard of any other systems that has a yearly gaming competition except for MAME Emulators :)
Now, let's turn the question around: what kinds of things does the C64 scene have that the Speccy scene doesn't?
Even the C64 joystick thingy is matchable now we're getting close to reproducing the Speccy's ULA from scratch. How does a miniturised Speccy sound?
People who "obviously" know that the C64 is better than the Speccy.
I like to call em' mugs :p
BEEP 1,1
Thats a bloody good point there.
I agree, Commodore users were maybee more fickle for a number of reasons.
As you say they were attracted by the colourfull graphics and nice sound and quicky mooved on when somthing better came allong.
C64's cost considerably more than a Spectrum, so the parents were obviously more willing to shell out for their kids than Spectrum owners. Therefore when somthing new came allong they were more likely to get brought it, and subsiquently forgot about the Commodore 64. Thats how it was for a lad I knew. When parents do that a kid fails to appreciate things as much as say a kid that gets nice gifts less frequently.
Maybe because the parents buying a Spectrum tended to be more frugal in nature, it meant that the kids had them for longer than say the C64 kids who had their computers for lesser periods. Thus we had more time to develop an affection for the machine. Even the BBC micro brigade began to gravitate towards the Archamedes in the late 80's.
I also think that parents who's offspring were likely to have nerdish tendancies would have brought, a Spectrum or a BBC Micro. A BBC micro because they could afford it, or a Spectrum because Sir Clive was a bit of a house hold british hero amongst those types of parent back then.
Another factor is that Spectrums remained relitively unchanged since 1982 (all be it a few cheap frills). Other manufacturers were offering superior machines (we'll forget about the QL) to tempt the user wich would of course been promoted in the mags for the relevant machine. With the Spectrum it took MGT to step up to the plate but by the time they did, it was too late.
Scottie! I salute you! :D
Well, they do have a quite active game music remixer scene. There are plenty of very good remixes of all those classic tunes, some of which were identical on our speccy as far as the melody is concerned. I'll happily admit I frequently listen to Slay Radio.
When I got the c64 I barely touched it programming wise...didn't seem user friendly at all so it was just a games machine.
and you didn't need to get it drunk neither
Oooh, rubber..I think we're getting to the bottom of this now.
Sit down child and tell me all about it.
where were we?
ah speccys
Whaaaa?!
Oh, I thought you were talking about rubberkeys.
Yeah you've only got to take one look at an Imput mag to see that. All sorts of weird and wonderfull meaningless uncontextualised characters in its syntax.
The good thing about programming on the early spectrum is that you have a Keyword reference straight infront of you on the keyboard.
From the perspective of a novice programmer the 48K basic was alot less fiddly than other basics. As it centered around ready made keywords the user was less prone to making sytax errors and typos, and could build a program very quickly. Also its system of syntax validation on line entry meant that entered programs only contained logic errors (if you count for without next and variable not found as logic errors). All this coupled with the on key programming references (or reminders), made it a very ideal platform for learning the basics of programming.
Personally I think that if the 48Ks had shipped with the 128K style basic, less kids would have found programming to be accesable on the Spectrum.
Aside from that little diversion, I've seen the claims that the fact that the Spectrum has an "all-in-one" site makes it more-loved. That's just stupid, because it denies the existence of GB64, etc. Lemon has everything that WOS does(minus the downloads, for the most part), but it also has user reviews and a MUCH better rating system. So, I think that the C64 has a better presence on the Internet.
Why is Internet capitalized, anyway? Who trademarked it? Why do I care?
The main speccite approach to this thread seems to be that because the content of slayradio, csdb, lemon, protovision, forum64, denial, sfodb, 64ending, c64gtw, HVSC, project64 etc. etc. (was that enough :p) aren't all at the same website then the Commodore scene isn't as big as the ZX scene.
Great theory.
Speccite? Specchum if you please...
The C64 has a Guitar Hero* game on the way, and already has more than one Dance Dance Revolution game.
Are there MMC/SD interfaces for the Spectrum yet?
IDE hard drives?
*One clever bit with this is the interface, taking any Playstation peripheral and mapping the inputs to a standard 9-pin joystick plug. May need a bit of rewiring for Spectrum, though.
Write games in C using Z88DK and SP1
Yep. http://baze.au.com/divide/