I think the Beatles were the best all rounders in history. They were the best or nearly the best in every area except maybe live performance. The Stones actually were a better band in terms of playing, but all we've got now are the records, and going by their albums if not their singles, The Beatles surely win. I mean, listen to an album like Their Satanic Majesties Request - pretty mediocre and a rip off of Pepper. The Beatles never stole from anyone like that.
Favourite Beatles song? That's a tough one, but I'll pump for the first one that really got me going- "The Fool On The Hill". Great tune, great words, brilliant production - well done, Sir Paul.
My favourite is different depending on my mood. Somedays I like the early Rock and Roll, sometimes the psychedelia and sometimes the later return good old fashioned Rock n Roll with their own voice. I'm not too keen on the overly poppy stuff but the Stones pop stuff was crap as well.
Rubber Soul,
Revolver,
The White Album and
Sargent Pepper are my favourite albums.
which talking of stealing from other bands is a blatant attempt to do a Beach Boys type song. John Lennon admitted in interviews that he would steal stuff from other bands. not that that makes them any better or worse
which talking of stealing from other bands is a blatant attempt to do a Beach Boys type song. John Lennon admitted in interviews that he would steal stuff from other bands. not that that makes them any better or worse
But obviously that's a homage, a parody which was suggested to them by Mike Love of the Beach Boys. The title "Back In The USSR" makes that obvious enough surely! And there's also "If I needed someone" which Harrison said "tell McGuinn that's my tribute to the Byrds." And 'Lady Madonna' (Fats Domino). What I'm talking about is copying obvious trends in the scene, trying to stay current. You never hear a Beatles album and say "oh that's just copying xxx". The Beatles use backwards guitar, then everyone else uses backwards guitar. They use orchestras on their songs, so then everyone else does. They sequence tracks together, so then everyone else does. They use sound effects on their singles, so then everyone else does.
The one big exception to this is The Beach Boys, who seemed to be in their own world, and were brilliant.
yeah you're right I agree they did innovate much more than they copied off others, and the beach boys thing was a homage, suppose it depends what you mean by 'copying' really, fair enough
Wasn't Brian Wilson at the same retreat in India as the Beatles when Back in the U.S.S.R. was being written and didn't he tell John how he had to namecheck all the soviet regions? I'm sure I heard an interview to that effect but I may be misremembering some or all of the details.
Allegedly Sargent Peppers is The Beatles attempt to do a Pet Sounds (my all time fav album) and after hearing how good it was it Brian Wilson had one of his breakdowns and didn't speak to anyone for 6 months.
never a fan of the beatles but i once went to new york, and i was staying close to the dakota building. we had a look round and then to a little memorial in the park close by. it was pretty sweet as it was getting dusk and there were all these little fireflies floating around, a good smell of fresh flowers and someone playing beatle songs on a guitar. (with a sign saying, 'im not a busker, i don't want any money')
Wasn't Brian Wilson at the same retreat in India as the Beatles when Back in the U.S.S.R. was being written and didn't he tell John how he had to namecheck all the soviet regions? I'm sure I heard an interview to that effect but I may be misremembering some or all of the details.
As mentioned in the earlier post, it was Mike Love who suggested the parody, and yes it was in India. Brian was asleep in bed at the time :D Mike Love still proudly goes on about his influence on that song in between counting the money he makes doing dreadful nostalgia concerts calling himself and one other guy "The Beach Boys" when clearly they are not. That guy has done more to destroy their credibility than everyone else put together.
Another thing about the Beatles not talked about enough was brought up by George Martin: "they never wrote the same song twice." Very good point.
Oh I'm sure they did. The trick is to only release the best one.
As I said earlier, we can only go by the records, which is what George Martin is talking about when he made that remark. The 'trick', as you call it, of releasing the best one in fact is the best twenty-eight when you are doing two albums of mostly original material a year, and that's what no one else was really able to pull off. Certainly the Stones couldn't do it - I can't even remember half of 'Aftermath'.
That's Sir Garfield Sobers to the likes of you, and anyway Ian 'Beefy' Botham was better than both of them.
the Beatles... oh right, I'm an Elvis man myself.
Who's this Sobers bloke? Mike Love? And Brian Wilson? I know Imran Kahn and Ian Botham are cricketers, and I think George Martin was the Beatles' producer (who mixed the songs)?
Well, alright, given that I wasn't born until 1970, that I can't play any instrument, and have no musical knowledge at all, then I'm obviously not the fifth Beatle. I could become a rapper, I suppose, provided I could act obnoxious and retarded.
But why was it, about ten years ago or so, lots of people suddenly started to claim that they were the fifth Beatle?
As I said earlier, we can only go by the records, which is what George Martin is talking about when he made that remark. The 'trick', as you call it, of releasing the best one in fact is the best twenty-eight when you are doing two albums of mostly original material a year, and that's what no one else was really able to pull off. Certainly the Stones couldn't do it - I can't even remember half of 'Aftermath'.
I'm certainly no musical judge (though of course I know what I like, which in a way is the purest form of judgement, in a subjective sense), but I know several people who are well up in music (I mean musical theory and actually playing instruments, not just who like listening to music) and they all have the highest regard for the Beatles output.
Mike Love still proudly goes on about his influence on that song in between counting the money he makes doing dreadful nostalgia concerts calling himself and one other guy "The Beach Boys" when clearly they are not. That guy has done more to destroy their credibility than everyone else put together.
.
yeah he's an idiot. my friend's got stacks of CDs of 'Smile' bootleg sessions and one of them has got a Mike Love and Al Jardine singing a joke song about how much they hate Brian Wilson's songs, that they were recording at the time! and there's Brian Wilson trying to make Smile which would have been one of the best albums ever going by what was completed. (I know brian wilson recently 'completed' it but its not the same35 odd years on to try and do it again). the original '67 demos are amazing
yeah he's an idiot. my friend's got stacks of CDs of 'Smile' bootleg sessions and one of them has got a Mike Love and Al Jardine singing a joke song about how much they hate Brian Wilson's songs, that they were recording at the time! and there's Brian Wilson trying to make Smile which would have been one of the best albums ever going by what was completed. (I know brian wilson recently 'completed' it but its not the same35 odd years on to try and do it again). the original '67 demos are amazing
You heard them too? Yeah I was blown away back in the mid 90s when I got my hands on a bootleg. The Smile sessions are so unique that Brian Wilson was almost creating a new genre with that album. You just can't compare "Surf's Up" to anything else at the time, and the instrumental "Holidays" - man! The guy is a genius :)
I'm not the biggest Beatles fan, but they do have the odd gem amongst their collection. She Loves You is fairly upbeat, and Yesterday is one of those pensive classics that might touch a nerve. These days if someone wants a depressing song, they listen to Radiohead and slit their wrists. Fortunately, this wasn't yet the done thing during the reign of the Beatles.
You heard them too? Yeah I was blown away back in the mid 90s when I got my hands on a bootleg. The Smile sessions are so unique that Brian Wilson was almost creating a new genre with that album. You just can't compare "Surf's Up" to anything else at the time, and the instrumental "Holidays" - man! The guy is a genius :)
yeah I got a 2xCD Smile Bootleg when I was at Sunderland Uni from a shop in Newcastle called "Pet Sounds" which only sold beach boys stuff! it was a really small shop and it's not there any more I don't think.... yeah those demo's are brilliant. and my friend has got hours of other smile session stuff off the net...a lot of its just talking and stuff but some of its interesting.
But obviously that's a homage, a parody which was suggested to them by Mike Love of the Beach Boys. The title "Back In The USSR" makes that obvious enough surely! And there's also "If I needed someone" which Harrison said "tell McGuinn that's my tribute to the Byrds." And 'Lady Madonna' (Fats Domino). What I'm talking about is copying obvious trends in the scene, trying to stay current. You never hear a Beatles album and say "oh that's just copying xxx". The Beatles use backwards guitar, then everyone else uses backwards guitar. They use orchestras on their songs, so then everyone else does. They sequence tracks together, so then everyone else does. They use sound effects on their singles, so then everyone else does.
The one big exception to this is The Beach Boys, who seemed to be in their own world, and were brilliant.
The Beach Boys actually released some great albums from '65-73. Pet Sounds is one of the greatest albums of all time, so is Smile (the new version).
Elvis? Virtually talentless. Only got to where he did cos he was the first. Had a fair voice but nothing more. Couldn't play an instrument (to any standard) and couldn't write a song.
Bigger fraud then Milli Vanilli...
Who's this Sobers bloke? Mike Love? And Brian Wilson? I know Imran Kahn and Ian Botham are cricketers, and I think George Martin was the Beatles' producer (who mixed the songs)?
Each to their own. I can remember the whole of Aftermath. Writing two albums of 'mostly original material' a year isn't that tricky. There are lyricists and composers whose annual output is much greater than that.
:D
Yes we all know that Andrew, but I meant two GOOD albums of original material! Loads of songwriters can churn them out like sausages... and you can tell. With Lennon and McCartney, you couldn't.
BTW regarding Aftermath, you gotta admit Doncha Bother Me is a bit of filler, no? :)
:D
Yes we all know that Andrew, but I meant two GOOD albums of original material! Loads of songwriters can churn them out like sausages... and you can tell. With Lennon and McCartney, you couldn't.
Boyzone pulled off the same trick with 2 of their best albums both coming out in 1995 - Father and Son and Key to My Life. Both are seminal works.
(thanks to psj3809 for the PM that drew this fact to my attention).
Elvis? Virtually talentless. Only got to where he did cos he was the first. Had a fair voice but nothing more. Couldn't play an instrument (to any standard) and couldn't write a song.
Bigger fraud then Milli Vanilli...
Same here ! Normally i pan a lot of singers who dont write their own lyrics, write the music etc (Like that idiot Robbie Williams) but Elvis really was something special. Granted he didnt write any of the songs but he really was an amazing singer and entertainer.
Same here ! Normally i pan a lot of singers who dont write their own lyrics, write the music etc (Like that idiot Robbie Williams) but Elvis really was something special. Granted he didnt write any of the songs but he really was an amazing singer and entertainer.
Elvis is credited as co-writer on nine of his songs, although how much writing he did on them is a matter of debate as it's a common way of dividing up the royalties from publishing between the writer and performer. He was definitely no Milli Vanilli though; the technology for faking it just wasn't up to the job back then.
Just to [not] get back on topic, I can't decide who's better at playing Beatle's songs. Consider "With a Little Help from My Friends" - Ringo vs Joe Cocker. For me, Ringo's version works in the context of Sgt. Pepper's, but Joe's version, standing on it's own, is completely mind blowing - that's the finest example I can think of how to rework a song. I blame Kevin Arnold and Winnie Cooper.
I'm still considering "She Came Through The Bathroom Window" - I think I prefer the original, compared to Cocker's cover.
And while I'm mulling it over it, I seem to remember there was the band Beatallica who mashed up Beatles/Metallica numbers in a Beatles/Metallica style...with real guitars... honest ;)
Comments
Favourite Beatles song? That's a tough one, but I'll pump for the first one that really got me going- "The Fool On The Hill". Great tune, great words, brilliant production - well done, Sir Paul.
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
That's because you're a better lyric writer than Paul McCartney :D
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
PMSL. You might want to listen again ;)
My favourite is different depending on my mood. Somedays I like the early Rock and Roll, sometimes the psychedelia and sometimes the later return good old fashioned Rock n Roll with their own voice. I'm not too keen on the overly poppy stuff but the Stones pop stuff was crap as well.
Rubber Soul,
Revolver,
The White Album and
Sargent Pepper are my favourite albums.
Todays favourite is probably Back in the USSR.
which talking of stealing from other bands is a blatant attempt to do a Beach Boys type song. John Lennon admitted in interviews that he would steal stuff from other bands. not that that makes them any better or worse
But obviously that's a homage, a parody which was suggested to them by Mike Love of the Beach Boys. The title "Back In The USSR" makes that obvious enough surely! And there's also "If I needed someone" which Harrison said "tell McGuinn that's my tribute to the Byrds." And 'Lady Madonna' (Fats Domino). What I'm talking about is copying obvious trends in the scene, trying to stay current. You never hear a Beatles album and say "oh that's just copying xxx". The Beatles use backwards guitar, then everyone else uses backwards guitar. They use orchestras on their songs, so then everyone else does. They sequence tracks together, so then everyone else does. They use sound effects on their singles, so then everyone else does.
The one big exception to this is The Beach Boys, who seemed to be in their own world, and were brilliant.
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
I'd go for Imran Khan and Gary Sobers myself. :smile:
Allegedly Sargent Peppers is The Beatles attempt to do a Pet Sounds (my all time fav album) and after hearing how good it was it Brian Wilson had one of his breakdowns and didn't speak to anyone for 6 months.
That's Sir Garfield Sobers to the likes of you, and anyway Ian 'Beefy' Botham was better than both of them.
the Beatles... oh right, I'm an Elvis man myself.
So where the beatles :)
As mentioned in the earlier post, it was Mike Love who suggested the parody, and yes it was in India. Brian was asleep in bed at the time :D Mike Love still proudly goes on about his influence on that song in between counting the money he makes doing dreadful nostalgia concerts calling himself and one other guy "The Beach Boys" when clearly they are not. That guy has done more to destroy their credibility than everyone else put together.
Another thing about the Beatles not talked about enough was brought up by George Martin: "they never wrote the same song twice." Very good point.
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
As I said earlier, we can only go by the records, which is what George Martin is talking about when he made that remark. The 'trick', as you call it, of releasing the best one in fact is the best twenty-eight when you are doing two albums of mostly original material a year, and that's what no one else was really able to pull off. Certainly the Stones couldn't do it - I can't even remember half of 'Aftermath'.
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
Who's this Sobers bloke? Mike Love? And Brian Wilson? I know Imran Kahn and Ian Botham are cricketers, and I think George Martin was the Beatles' producer (who mixed the songs)?
Well, alright, given that I wasn't born until 1970, that I can't play any instrument, and have no musical knowledge at all, then I'm obviously not the fifth Beatle. I could become a rapper, I suppose, provided I could act obnoxious and retarded.
But why was it, about ten years ago or so, lots of people suddenly started to claim that they were the fifth Beatle?
I'm certainly no musical judge (though of course I know what I like, which in a way is the purest form of judgement, in a subjective sense), but I know several people who are well up in music (I mean musical theory and actually playing instruments, not just who like listening to music) and they all have the highest regard for the Beatles output.
yeah he's an idiot. my friend's got stacks of CDs of 'Smile' bootleg sessions and one of them has got a Mike Love and Al Jardine singing a joke song about how much they hate Brian Wilson's songs, that they were recording at the time! and there's Brian Wilson trying to make Smile which would have been one of the best albums ever going by what was completed. (I know brian wilson recently 'completed' it but its not the same35 odd years on to try and do it again). the original '67 demos are amazing
You heard them too? Yeah I was blown away back in the mid 90s when I got my hands on a bootleg. The Smile sessions are so unique that Brian Wilson was almost creating a new genre with that album. You just can't compare "Surf's Up" to anything else at the time, and the instrumental "Holidays" - man! The guy is a genius :)
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
Yesterday
and
She Loves You
I'm not the biggest Beatles fan, but they do have the odd gem amongst their collection. She Loves You is fairly upbeat, and Yesterday is one of those pensive classics that might touch a nerve. These days if someone wants a depressing song, they listen to Radiohead and slit their wrists. Fortunately, this wasn't yet the done thing during the reign of the Beatles.
yeah I got a 2xCD Smile Bootleg when I was at Sunderland Uni from a shop in Newcastle called "Pet Sounds" which only sold beach boys stuff! it was a really small shop and it's not there any more I don't think.... yeah those demo's are brilliant. and my friend has got hours of other smile session stuff off the net...a lot of its just talking and stuff but some of its interesting.
The Beach Boys actually released some great albums from '65-73. Pet Sounds is one of the greatest albums of all time, so is Smile (the new version).
Bigger fraud then Milli Vanilli...
If you don't know who Garfield Sobers is, watch this:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=G4QRk_yDd28
Brian Wilson and Mike Love were in The Beach Boys in case you've not worked it out by now.
:D
Yes we all know that Andrew, but I meant two GOOD albums of original material! Loads of songwriters can churn them out like sausages... and you can tell. With Lennon and McCartney, you couldn't.
BTW regarding Aftermath, you gotta admit Doncha Bother Me is a bit of filler, no? :)
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
Mike Love? Never heard of him :)
https://discordapp.com/invite/cZt59EQ
Boyzone pulled off the same trick with 2 of their best albums both coming out in 1995 - Father and Son and Key to My Life. Both are seminal works.
(thanks to psj3809 for the PM that drew this fact to my attention).
Sorry I'm not biting.
Same here ! Normally i pan a lot of singers who dont write their own lyrics, write the music etc (Like that idiot Robbie Williams) but Elvis really was something special. Granted he didnt write any of the songs but he really was an amazing singer and entertainer.
Elvis is credited as co-writer on nine of his songs, although how much writing he did on them is a matter of debate as it's a common way of dividing up the royalties from publishing between the writer and performer. He was definitely no Milli Vanilli though; the technology for faking it just wasn't up to the job back then.
I'm still considering "She Came Through The Bathroom Window" - I think I prefer the original, compared to Cocker's cover.
And while I'm mulling it over it, I seem to remember there was the band Beatallica who mashed up Beatles/Metallica numbers in a Beatles/Metallica style...with real guitars... honest ;)