On 2004-10-29 22:26, mel the bell wrote:
I aint got an inferiority complex at all ....i just HATE jumped up little shits who think theyre better than everybody else from the off
i think being a member of one of the best magazines for one of the best computers and also being neck deep in the sam coupe scene has really gone to your head tbh and youve really took all the praise and adulation a bit too far.
sure your head still fits through the door?
You sure seem to be talking about someone else, and not me. The only reason I can see for this is some kind of inferiority complex. I don't think I'm better than anyone else - but I do know when I've got my facts right.
If you think this equates with thinking that I'm "better" than someone else, you're sorely mistaken.
I'm just picking up on a common pattern here. Since my first post, you've been saying "lawks a lordy, he thinks he's lord Muck, comin' in here, prancin' about, makin' fun of the commoners like me"...
... and I have no idea where that attitude comes from.
So sorry if I've offended you, but you're the one who seems to be running around on your high horse, trying to paint me as an egotistical maniac. And the only reason I can think of for you doing that is because you want to take pot shots at me because you perceive me to be someone who is ... erm... what's that word that means the opposite of underdog?
On 2004-10-29 21:12, spectecjr wrote:
What's it doing?
When it installed, my system kept locking for around 1 second (even the hard drive stopped). This was happening every 30 seconds.
So, I uninstalled it, and now IE doesn't open new links, just a blank page. If I press stop & reload it loads. Also, javascripts don't work. Tried all the patches etc, and still nowt.
I had this with my old xp2200 and the only solution was to wipe my hard drive & re-install. Now I've got an amd64 and can't be arsed with re-installing so I just put Mozilla on instead.
And for the record, I run a company selling PC's and doing on-site repairs, so its not even as if I am a novice. I have had loads of people putting SP2 on cos it downloads and they think they have to install it. It doesn't seem to matter what hardware you have it will only install on around 50% of PC's that I have dealt with.
The main systems which have had problems installing it appear to be those with browser-hijack spyware on their systems. The browser changes, the hijack no longer works, and so IE is left in a screwed up state because the hijack software futzed with it.
You might want to try running ad-aware (http://www.lavasoft.de) on systems before installing SP2 and see what it pulls up.
On 2004-10-29 22:26, mel the bell wrote:
I aint got an inferiority complex at all ....i just HATE jumped up little shits who think theyre better than everybody else from the off
i think being a member of one of the best magazines for one of the best computers and also being neck deep in the sam coupe scene has really gone to your head tbh and youve really took all the praise and adulation a bit too far.
sure your head still fits through the door?
You sure seem to be talking about someone else, and not me. The only reason I can see for this is some kind of inferiority complex. I don't think I'm better than anyone else - but I do know when I've got my facts right.
If you think this equates with thinking that I'm "better" than someone else, you're sorely mistaken.
I'm just picking up on a common pattern here. Since my first post, you've been saying "lawks a lordy, he thinks he's lord Muck, comin' in here, prancin' about, makin' fun of the commoners like me"...
... and I have no idea where that attitude comes from.
So sorry if I've offended you, but you're the one who seems to be running around on your high horse, trying to paint me as an egotistical maniac. And the only reason I can think of for you doing that is because you want to take pot shots at me because you perceive me to be someone who is ... erm... what's that word that means the opposite of underdog?
i only take pot shots when i take a dislike to somebody, which is usually never, but well done cos with our first meeting you managed to make my shitlist
Professional Mel-the-Bell Simulator................"So realistic, I found myself reaching for the Kleenex King-Size!" - Richard Darling
I suspect that was the problem with the xp2200 cos I did have kazaa on, but I've never had any on my new system. There has also been an issue with nvidia drivers and sp2. Funnily enough, Microsoft claim that they are not compatible with sp2. nvidia wrote their drivers first, so surely its sp2 that isn't compatible?
On 2004-10-29 22:40, mel the bell wrote:
i only take pot shots when i take a dislike to somebody, which is usually never, but well done cos with our first meeting you managed to make my shitlist
Well, congratulations. I hope that serves you well in future endeavours.
On 2004-10-29 22:40, fogartylee wrote:
I suspect that was the problem with the xp2200 cos I did have kazaa on, but I've never had any on my new system. There has also been an issue with nvidia drivers and sp2. Funnily enough, Microsoft claim that they are not compatible with sp2. nvidia wrote their drivers first, so surely its sp2 that isn't compatible?
That's one way of looking at it, but there's also the fact that MS locked down a lot of their APIs and removed some compatibility stuff that they had in there just to make things work when 3rd party vendors (eg. Nvidia) botched something up. (They do a lot of this kind of compatibility work behind the scenes to get other peoples' stuff to work - read their blogs).
In this case, they decided that security was more important than compatibility.
It went through about 4 months of beta testing (I was in on that through where I work), but of course some things are going to fall through the cracks.
I use nVidia cards pretty much exclusively (I've not trusted ATI since I spent a lot of money a few years ago for one and they never updated the exceptionally buggy drivers)... I've not seen any of these problems, so I assume it must be with a really old driver, or with one of their nForce boards...?
At the end of the day, why should I suffer because Microsoft can't get their act together?
SP2 doesn't seem to do anything that can't be done better elsewhere. Having an automatic download is convenient, but having one that screws you computer up is just iresponsible and no better than the software it is trying to stop.
I think I'll stick with Norton and continue to advise my customers likewise until MS get their act together.
On 2004-10-29 23:42, fogartylee wrote:
Its a geforce card, and only 4 months old!
And which driver version is giving you the compatibility errors? Because I've got a Geforce Go 5700 on my laptop, a Geforce 4 on one of my home machines, a Geforce 6 on the other, and a Geforce 2 MX 200 on my work machine. None of these had problems with XP SP2. Not one.
At the end of the day, why should I suffer because Microsoft can't get their act together?
What makes you think they don't have their act together? For a start, are you running WHQL certified drivers? nVidia does make them as well as their others. If you're not running the WHQL ones, then they're not certified to work well with Windows.
Secondly, your experience is entirely contrary to mine on several different machines all running nVidia cards of various ages. Which seems to indicate that the problem isn't necessarily what you think it is. Again, I point you to the possibility of spyware issues - unless you'd like to point me in the direction of where you got that info re: the supposed incompatibility.
SP2 doesn't seem to do anything that can't be done better elsewhere. Having an automatic download is convenient, but having one that screws you computer up is just iresponsible and no better than the software it is trying to stop.
... apart from the fixes they made to SP2 for IE, the additions they made so that even if you use Firefox to download an app to your desktop, it'll still warn you if you try to run it, and the fact that they recompiled the whole OS with stack guard canaries turned on so that remote exploits through buffer overflows become nearly impossible, added NX support for processors that have it to help even more with that... sure! you're absolutely right!
I think I'll stick with Norton and continue to advise my customers likewise until MS get their act together.
How about figuring out what the problem is first, before you start going off half-cocked?
I would hardly call it going off half cocked. I have a lot of customers using nvidia cards that are experiencing problems. I have a choice. Do I charge ?40 every time they install sp2 (bearing in mind they are calling me cos they have limited knowledge), or do I charge them ?40 once and advise they don't use sp2? I like my customers to come back, and recommend me to their friends. Therefore, using the BEST advice gets return customers.
I could go all technical on them and come across as condescending, but that wouldn't help.
I just ran a seacrh for nvidia sp2 problems and came across 264,000 pages.
On 2004-10-30 00:20, fogartylee wrote:
I would hardly call it going off half cocked. I have a lot of customers using nvidia cards that are experiencing problems. I have a choice. Do I charge ?40 every time they install sp2 (bearing in mind they are calling me cos they have limited knowledge), or do I charge them ?40 once and advise they don't use sp2? I like my customers to come back, and recommend me to their friends. Therefore, using the BEST advice gets return customers.
I could go all technical on them and come across as condescending, but that wouldn't help.
Thing is, my experience is the direct opposite of yours - with the same class of cards, and the same drivers. Which points to it being something else that's the problem - not SP2.
I just ran a seacrh for nvidia sp2 problems and came across 264,000 pages.
Congrats. I just ran a search for spectrum runs on lard and came across 2,460 pages. Last time I checked, however, the spectrum did not in fact run on lard.
Nothing on that page nails it to an incompatibility with nvidia and XP SP2. The only person who even HAS an nVidia system says - and I quote -
I installed it the other day. Wouldn't boot for a while, IE would make my comp run at full load, like I was running 2 primes or something....Blue screen of death every 20 min...
Uninstalled it and everything is back to normal. Do not install SP2 yet!!!!
... which sounds like yet another browser hijack/spyware problem, given that it's IE that causes the hang.
Look, what you're doing with your customers makes sense in the short term. However, you still might want to try to figure out what the real problem is. nVidia tech support certainly doesn't know anything about any incompatibility.
Y'Know, despite the M$ troll that's started hanging around, and all the explanations about SP2, I've still yet to see a valid reason for allowing SP2 anywhere near my PC.
SpecTecJr? You were one of the original YS (Your Sinclair, not the fantastic predecessor, Your Spectrum) crew?
On 2004-10-30 01:54, Dunny wrote:
Y'Know, despite the M$ troll that's started hanging around, and all the explanations about SP2, I've still yet to see a valid reason for allowing SP2 anywhere near my PC.
SpecTecJr? You were one of the original YS (Your Sinclair, not the fantastic predecessor, Your Spectrum) crew?
I've come across a few problems at work with SP2 - and to be honest, they've boiled down (after a lot of digging into the customers problems) to: Adware/spyware/virus related issues, driver clashes (as SpecTecJr basically says - the right ones can help here) or - ahem - user error.
Of course, there is also the issue with P4's - that caused a crash unless you disable hyperthreading - in some cases... but thats not really Microsofts fault :)
My other half runs a site (www.parentsandtots.com) and this discussion has come up on there as well. As fas as I know, only a couple of people have got sp2 working.
My point is that if a service pack is going to be more or less forced on you, Microsoft have duty to make sure it works without fault, or at the very least make sure it is compatible.
The issue of spyware keeps coming up. I don't have any. Having said that, a lot of customers do.
My customers however are mostly novices and students (Nottingham having a huge student base), so I see a lot of people confused as to what sp2 is doing to their system.
On 2004-10-30 07:08, fogartylee wrote:
My other half runs a site (www.parentsandtots.com) and this discussion has come up on there as well. As fas as I know, only a couple of people have got sp2 working.
Whereas I don't know anyone who has had problems - except me, and that's because Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 with hyperthreading turned on causes problems - but that's because of a compatibility hack that they put in for Adobe Premiere Pro 1.0 which is getting activated for 1.5. Allegedly.
My point is that if a service pack is going to be more or less forced on you, Microsoft have duty to make sure it works without fault, or at the very least make sure it is compatible.
Agreed. I'm not sure how much more effort they're supposed to put into this though. They had a very public beta with thousands of people involved. They had their own internal test team, with thousands of people doing nothing but testing it. Nearly the entire Windows team was taken off Longhorn to work on SP2. There's not much more testing they can do on this short of releasing it and seeing what happens.
The issue of spyware keeps coming up. I don't have any. Having said that, a lot of customers do.
Have you tried throwing a copy of Ad-Aware at the problem? It's a free download.
My customers however are mostly novices and students (Nottingham having a huge student base), so I see a lot of people confused as to what sp2 is doing to their system.
Understandable. The problem is though, that it's not necessarily SP2 that is causing the problems here.
I do try to recommend to customers that they use adaware, but by the time they have called me its often too late. My experience is that once SP2 is installed, it is often quite difficult to uninstall or repair.
Then there are the students that just wont take the advice not to use kazaa, and back up files regularly. I have had many repeat calls from them wanting to know why the problem keeps occuring!
No offense to students (I am one myself), but I have to wonder how they can study when they cant even take advice!
If Microsoft are (or were) aware of the problem with spyware, why not integrate a check in the SP2 installation?
Oh dear, you really do have issues don't you? I voiced my opinion the mag sucked, and you bit. Or was it about the M$ Trolling? Which, considering that you've flamed and insulted people (or at least one person) for not understanding Windows, is probably unfair - trolls usually don't hang around.
You're very, very, sad.
So if in your esteemed opinion I need SP2, why has my computer not crashed? If it's that damned important, how come adaware/avg don't show up any results after a scan? Seems to me that security is down more to the individual user than the OS in this respect.
On 2004-10-30 20:07, spectecjr wrote:
I believe that this is the point where I give you the finger and leave the thread. Have fun now.
This is great - I've developed a new spectator sport! I'm having marvellous fun watching you resort to insults and other abuse as you wander from thread to thread, unable to retort more effectively as you obviously have a lower grasp of english than most.
To be honest, I'm not surprised you wrote for YS, and I'm certainly not surprised RG didn't contact you about issue 94.
Comments
You sure seem to be talking about someone else, and not me. The only reason I can see for this is some kind of inferiority complex. I don't think I'm better than anyone else - but I do know when I've got my facts right.
If you think this equates with thinking that I'm "better" than someone else, you're sorely mistaken.
I'm just picking up on a common pattern here. Since my first post, you've been saying "lawks a lordy, he thinks he's lord Muck, comin' in here, prancin' about, makin' fun of the commoners like me"...
... and I have no idea where that attitude comes from.
So sorry if I've offended you, but you're the one who seems to be running around on your high horse, trying to paint me as an egotistical maniac. And the only reason I can think of for you doing that is because you want to take pot shots at me because you perceive me to be someone who is ... erm... what's that word that means the opposite of underdog?
The main systems which have had problems installing it appear to be those with browser-hijack spyware on their systems. The browser changes, the hijack no longer works, and so IE is left in a screwed up state because the hijack software futzed with it.
You might want to try running ad-aware (http://www.lavasoft.de) on systems before installing SP2 and see what it pulls up.
by the way fog you noticed your post count? 333
halfway to becoming a devil you know, well done
Well, congratulations. I hope that serves you well in future endeavours.
Wrong :p
That's one way of looking at it, but there's also the fact that MS locked down a lot of their APIs and removed some compatibility stuff that they had in there just to make things work when 3rd party vendors (eg. Nvidia) botched something up. (They do a lot of this kind of compatibility work behind the scenes to get other peoples' stuff to work - read their blogs).
In this case, they decided that security was more important than compatibility.
It went through about 4 months of beta testing (I was in on that through where I work), but of course some things are going to fall through the cracks.
I use nVidia cards pretty much exclusively (I've not trusted ATI since I spent a lot of money a few years ago for one and they never updated the exceptionally buggy drivers)... I've not seen any of these problems, so I assume it must be with a really old driver, or with one of their nForce boards...?
At the end of the day, why should I suffer because Microsoft can't get their act together?
SP2 doesn't seem to do anything that can't be done better elsewhere. Having an automatic download is convenient, but having one that screws you computer up is just iresponsible and no better than the software it is trying to stop.
I think I'll stick with Norton and continue to advise my customers likewise until MS get their act together.
And which driver version is giving you the compatibility errors? Because I've got a Geforce Go 5700 on my laptop, a Geforce 4 on one of my home machines, a Geforce 6 on the other, and a Geforce 2 MX 200 on my work machine. None of these had problems with XP SP2. Not one.
What makes you think they don't have their act together? For a start, are you running WHQL certified drivers? nVidia does make them as well as their others. If you're not running the WHQL ones, then they're not certified to work well with Windows.
Secondly, your experience is entirely contrary to mine on several different machines all running nVidia cards of various ages. Which seems to indicate that the problem isn't necessarily what you think it is. Again, I point you to the possibility of spyware issues - unless you'd like to point me in the direction of where you got that info re: the supposed incompatibility.
... apart from the fixes they made to SP2 for IE, the additions they made so that even if you use Firefox to download an app to your desktop, it'll still warn you if you try to run it, and the fact that they recompiled the whole OS with stack guard canaries turned on so that remote exploits through buffer overflows become nearly impossible, added NX support for processors that have it to help even more with that... sure! you're absolutely right!
How about figuring out what the problem is first, before you start going off half-cocked?
I could go all technical on them and come across as condescending, but that wouldn't help.
I just ran a seacrh for nvidia sp2 problems and came across 264,000 pages.
http://www.tweaknews.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3364
Thing is, my experience is the direct opposite of yours - with the same class of cards, and the same drivers. Which points to it being something else that's the problem - not SP2.
Congrats. I just ran a search for spectrum runs on lard and came across 2,460 pages. Last time I checked, however, the spectrum did not in fact run on lard.
Nothing on that page nails it to an incompatibility with nvidia and XP SP2. The only person who even HAS an nVidia system says - and I quote -
... which sounds like yet another browser hijack/spyware problem, given that it's IE that causes the hang.
Look, what you're doing with your customers makes sense in the short term. However, you still might want to try to figure out what the real problem is. nVidia tech support certainly doesn't know anything about any incompatibility.
SpecTecJr? You were one of the original YS (Your Sinclair, not the fantastic predecessor, Your Spectrum) crew?
Man, that mag sucked.
D.
You sir, are a buffoon.
Of course, there is also the issue with P4's - that caused a crash unless you disable hyperthreading - in some cases... but thats not really Microsofts fault :)
My point is that if a service pack is going to be more or less forced on you, Microsoft have duty to make sure it works without fault, or at the very least make sure it is compatible.
The issue of spyware keeps coming up. I don't have any. Having said that, a lot of customers do.
My customers however are mostly novices and students (Nottingham having a huge student base), so I see a lot of people confused as to what sp2 is doing to their system.
Whereas I don't know anyone who has had problems - except me, and that's because Adobe Premiere Pro 1.5 with hyperthreading turned on causes problems - but that's because of a compatibility hack that they put in for Adobe Premiere Pro 1.0 which is getting activated for 1.5. Allegedly.
Agreed. I'm not sure how much more effort they're supposed to put into this though. They had a very public beta with thousands of people involved. They had their own internal test team, with thousands of people doing nothing but testing it. Nearly the entire Windows team was taken off Longhorn to work on SP2. There's not much more testing they can do on this short of releasing it and seeing what happens.
Have you tried throwing a copy of Ad-Aware at the problem? It's a free download.
Understandable. The problem is though, that it's not necessarily SP2 that is causing the problems here.
Then there are the students that just wont take the advice not to use kazaa, and back up files regularly. I have had many repeat calls from them wanting to know why the problem keeps occuring!
No offense to students (I am one myself), but I have to wonder how they can study when they cant even take advice!
If Microsoft are (or were) aware of the problem with spyware, why not integrate a check in the SP2 installation?
Oh dear, you really do have issues don't you? I voiced my opinion the mag sucked, and you bit. Or was it about the M$ Trolling? Which, considering that you've flamed and insulted people (or at least one person) for not understanding Windows, is probably unfair - trolls usually don't hang around.
You're very, very, sad.
So if in your esteemed opinion I need SP2, why has my computer not crashed? If it's that damned important, how come adaware/avg don't show up any results after a scan? Seems to me that security is down more to the individual user than the OS in this respect.
D.
Quote `You Sir, are a bafoon`
top marks for antiquated language though, jolly good fun, eh chaps, perhaps we could have a corner, where people can go and stand for being naughty...
Me too.
D.
I believe that this is the point where I give you the finger and leave the thread. Have fun now.
Sig for sale....
This is great - I've developed a new spectator sport! I'm having marvellous fun watching you resort to insults and other abuse as you wander from thread to thread, unable to retort more effectively as you obviously have a lower grasp of english than most.
To be honest, I'm not surprised you wrote for YS, and I'm certainly not surprised RG didn't contact you about issue 94.
D.
Note to mel: Learn to express yourself more
_________________
I wanna tell you a story 'bout a woman I know...
[ This Message was edited by: karingal on 2004-10-31 01:07 ]
I find jokes about beating US presidents in very poor taste.