I'm not going to answer that stupid question with an actual list of what is crap and what isn't. Just as many games on the Spectrum, C64, Amiga and other platforms are crap - because let's face it, not all games are great - the same goes for NES games too.
But including emulation (which let's face it we ALL do) is a long overdue inclusion.
Until Retro Gamer came out, I honestly didn't know about emulators that you could just download! I'd seen those CD's of Speccy/C64?Amiga etc that you used to find in GAME and HMV, but I had no idea you could download it all yourself.
If it wasn't for that first magazine, I probably wouldn't have found here and I certainly wouldn't have discovered the joys of emulating MAME, Megadrive, SNES and so on. Those early issues always had emulators on the discs and small features on how to use them and it's where I learnt how to use many of the emulators that I still use today!
So yes, a decent feature on emulators would be a good idea. Infact, I'd like to see it becoming a regular feature each month, concentrating on one system at a time. Maybe with interviews with the people responsible for writing them and running through which ones are the best in terms of performance or features. MAME vs RAINE for example (if RAINE is still around?)
As for the magazine these days, yeah, it's not as good as it used to be. Infact, I'm starting to get bored with it as it seems to be covering the same things over and over, but I still buy it each month as I have a complete set, although, it's not all in the same place. I'm gonna have to dig around for them all!
Until Retro Gamer came out, I honestly didn't know about emulators that you could just download! I'd seen those CD's of Speccy/C64?Amiga etc that you used to find in GAME and HMV, but I had no idea you could download it all yourself.
I was in to emulators even before I even knew what it was. Back in the day when a friend and me had bought QL's we talked about writing an emulator so we could play Spectrum games on the QL. We never even started though - we didn't even know how to begin (we were coding 68000 though) but handling the Spectrum screen was a big theoretic hurdle in those pre-internet days. Thumbs up for those people brighter than us (ie: almost everyone) who managed it. :D
Knowing what I know now it should be possible but it would never have run at anyting even resembling the needed speed to be enjoyable.
A few years later I got the first "real" Spectrum emulator for my (then new) Amiga and had fun with that. That wasn't close to full speed either...but it still seemed like magic. :)
As for the magazine these days, yeah, it's not as good as it used to be. Infact, I'm starting to get bored with it as it seems to be covering the same things over and over, but I still buy it each month as I have a complete set, although, it's not all in the same place.
I have to agree but also comment that it wasn't always rosy red either. RG may not be "what it used to be" but try to go back to the beginning - they weren't all that good in the beginning (well, that's what I think every time I pull out the old issues, anyway). Massive props to Martyn Carroll for starting the whole thing up but things definitely improved once Darran took over. See, I'm not always being negative. :lol:
I'm not going to answer that stupid question with an actual list of what is crap and what isn't. Just as many games on the Spectrum, C64, Amiga and other platforms are crap - because let's face it, not all games are great - the same goes for NES games too.
YOU have made it a stupid question by (deliberately?) misinterpreting the point being made.
Who said all (NES) games are great ? did I?
I said the classic games.
There might be some quibbling around the boundaries of what is and is not a classic; but there are games that are bonafide classics. That was the point.
Yes there are crap games on all systems. Just as many of the spectrum? Thousands more so, because of the ease of which low quality titles could be produced and distributed.
YOU have made it a stupid question by (deliberately?) misinterpreting the point being made.
Who said all (NES) games are great ? did I?
I said the classic games.
Hmm, I have to admit that I did notice the 'classic' part but conveniently (but not intentionally) forgot about that when I answered, so perhaps I was a bit too fast in answering. My mistake. ;)
Until Retro Gamer came out, I honestly didn't know about emulators...
Hold back on any praise though. This was the "original" Retro Gamer which, the current team will tell you, was amateurish and fanzine-like.
I've read about 5-10% of the last 20 issues or so. It's the only mag I buy and do so through nothing but habit. Reading a recent post where they discuss the mag's owners buying the Crash and Zzap 64 names I've decided to spend my ?5 a month on old issues of Crash, YS and Sinclair User.
It is completely possible - and the rational thing to do - to be able to accept the quality of something without liking it. I don't like Beethoven; but to call Beethoven crap would not be showing my opinion, it would be showing my ignorance.
I don't like Knight Lore. I know it is far from crap, in fact it is a masterpiece. I just don't like it.
Likewise saying classic NES games are crap. Of course they are not. They too are masterpieces. It's just that you don't like them. That's not subjective, it is objective.
I get to decide what constitutes crap to me...not you. That's not subjective. Opinion is ALWAYS subjective..that's why it's called opinion and not fact. Google "Opinion" if you are not sure of the definition...
I'm really hoping that Jumping Stack was trying to be funny...or something...because that is the stupidest and most uninterresting idea I've ever heard. I don't post much on the RG forums but an article wasting pages like this would certainly get me writing there - and not something positive.
Sorreee, I thought my comment was so absurdly stupid that it would be seen as intended - a comment on the repetitive closed loop of nostalgic journalism. Even on WoS we see the same subjects come up endlessly - I don't mind it one bit on here, but to try and sell that for real money without shaking it up is cul-de-sac stuff.
So probably Retro Gamer has to shake things up from time to time even if it alienates or doesn't work. Better to try it than to become a collector-only magazine.
Good on Retro Gamer, I say, for at least trying to exist into the bold new retro future. :???:
And as Beanz says the NES and Pokemon crap isn't crap at all to some Americans (or something along those lines)
Anyway, not my subject. NES games might not even all be crap for all I know. It understand that it is all əˈpinyən/
Perhaps Daz@Retrogamer could bravely pop up into the thread? Is he still going? I vaguely remember a flounce? C'mon Dazster!
YOU have made it a stupid question by (deliberately?) misinterpreting the point being made.
Who said all (NES) games are great ? did I?
I said the classic games.
There might be some quibbling around the boundaries of what is and is not a classic; but there are games that are bonafide classics. That was the point.
Yes there are crap games on all systems. Just as many of the spectrum? Thousands more so, because of the ease of which low quality titles could be produced and distributed.
Oh for gods sake shut up! Sound like 2 bloody 8 years olds!
Oh for gods sake shut up! Sound like 2 bloody 8 years olds!
Agreed!!
I like it and buy it, I fully understand the Spectrum content will be limited as the number of retro machines is huge and every machine that is superseded becomes retro but am grateful for the any Spectrum coverage.
Secondly, yes you could find a lot of content on the internet but I'm old and I like the physical aspect of Retro Gamer, I like to pick it up, flick through it, I lose interest in something far quicker if I'm reading it onscreen.
If you like it buy it, if you don't then don't bother, then everyone's happy...
Oh and you do realise you're not even discussing Retro Gamer anymore don't you...
I'm not sure what that link is trying to prove? That I asked what classic NES games are "crap"? That was a genuine point. The genuine point was, that the quality of a classic retro game (or art, or music, or literature) is independent of one person (or persons) thinking it is crap. There is a difference between objective (which a reviewer should attempt to acheive) and subjective (which a reviewer should try to avoid because a subjective, unqualified opinion, is of no use to anybody reading the review, unless of course, the reviewer has such a weight of experience that the reader can understand the sujectivism).
Retro gamer is not just about zx spectrum in particular, it is about retro games in general, so it seems a bit weird that there can be any complaint that it's content is exactly what it says on the cover.
As has been said, the same discussions come up on WOS all the time; which is understandable, given the limited life-span and limited number of truly classic games on spectrum. A magazine could not keep rehasing the same limited period and genre. Which IS the point of the discussion. I don't like Pokemon, I was too old for it when it came around. Does not make it crap. Millions bought it and enjoyed it. The characters and gameplay have stood the test of time. It was a classic retro game; on a classic retro machine (gameboy). Is it really suprising to see such a title in a retro magazine?
And yes, I do realise I was not discussing retro gamer; it seems to have moved into a quibble about who said this and who said that; a quibble which you have now included yourself in, and chose fit to extend, for some bizarre reason (antagonism?)
somebody has a different opinion to the not-so-almightly Jones? heaven forbid.
This is a discussion forum isn't it? So why don't YOU shut up if you are not interested in this thread of the discussion.
You sound like a bloody grumpy old man!
I don't agree or disagree with either of you. I was just pointing out how babyish you both sound having a petty argument in full view of everyone. And you then make yourself look even more immature by throwing in a 'hilarious' insult towards myself.
I'm not sure what that link is trying to prove? That I asked what classic NES games are "crap"? That was a genuine point. The genuine point was, that the quality of a classic retro game (or art, or music, or literature) is independent of one person (or persons) thinking it is crap. There is a difference between objective (which a reviewer should attempt to acheive) and subjective (which a reviewer should try to avoid because a subjective, unqualified opinion, is of no use to anybody reading the review, unless of course, the reviewer has such a weight of experience that the reader can understand the sujectivism).
Retro gamer is not just about zx spectrum in particular, it is about retro games in general, so it seems a bit weird that there can be any complaint that it's content is exactly what it says on the cover.
As has been said, the same discussions come up on WOS all the time; which is understandable, given the limited life-span and limited number of truly classic games on spectrum. A magazine could not keep rehasing the same limited period and genre. Which IS the point of the discussion. I don't like Pokemon, I was too old for it when it came around. Does not make it crap. Millions bought it and enjoyed it. The characters and gameplay have stood the test of time. It was a classic retro game; on a classic retro machine (gameboy). Is it really suprising to see such a title in a retro magazine?
And yes, I do realise I was not discussing retro gamer; it seems to have moved into a quibble about who said this and who said that; a quibble which you have now included yourself in, and chose fit to extend, for some bizarre reason (antagonism?)
The link is proving what a school ground argument this looks like rather than an intelligent discussion amongst people with differing opinions.
A phrase came to mind when I saw that post "Desperately clutching at straws"...
I don't agree or disagree with either of you. I was just pointing out how babyish you both sound having a petty argument in full view of everyone. And you then make yourself look even more immature by throwing in a 'hilarious' insult towards myself.
Grow up!
yes dad
what is strange, is that you didn't like a particular post (or posts) and deemed yourself referee of what opinions are or are not worthy of discussion. Its petty, but you cannot help but get involved? Maybe you could say something constructive and bring the discussion around to your way of thinking without starting a pointless flame war over old computer games. Don't you see how "babyish" that is? You are free to disassociate yourself from a parts of a discussion that are too immature for you? All things in perspective, middle aged men arguing about the contents of a magazine that relives their childhood is not the best place to become a referee and decide who is being the most immature? Is it?
yet you continue to involve yourself in a "school ground argument?"
A phrase came to mind when I saw your post, "pot kettle black"...
Nope, I'm on the outside looking in.
I'm commenting directly on the Retro Gamer debate. Nothing to do with your childish spate concerning crap NES games.
I've made one comment and it's fairly obvious the way it's worded that I'm not up for discussion about it. Just MY opinion.
Oh and don't try and be clever, you're not very good at it...
It is NOT about muscling out, it is about inclusion and expansion.
Should a retro gaming magazine be about retro gaming
or
should it be about "8-bit-British-computer-gaming-of the-1980s-for-those-that-were-there"
Nngh. I clearly haven't got the hang of this whole "explaining yourself clearly" thing yet. What I want personally from Retro Gamer, and what I personally think is good for the magazine, are two separate things.
No, I don't think that Retro Gamer should be entirely concerned with "8-bit British computer gaming of the 1980s for those that were there". But SURELY that was the very credo the magazine was built upon? I mean, I don't know... That certainly seemed to be the case when the mag was rescued from the ashes of Live Publishing. Back then, Retro Gamer was very much about preaching nostalgia to the already-converted. But even that era is "retro" now.
The mission statement these days? Well maybe it's more along the lines of "mass-market video game franchises with long lineage and (ideally) contemporary presence, peppered with farmed-out articles by and for the geeks". That pretty much sums up the contents of the magazine that continues to hit my doormat once a month. I refer you back to my original post for (yet more overly verbose) details on why I think that's a recipe for disaster.
What would I like personally? It's perfectly simple: wall-to-wall nostalgia. Not all of it aimed at me personally you understand, but for each generation to experience the same "wow, I'd forgotten that!" or "now here's something for me to get my teeth into" feeling as I would for the bits that interested me. So no more six-page glamour spreads of obscure consoles with a 5:50 copy/photo ratio. No more future classics or pages of fawning in-the-publisher's-pocket reviews of New Old Game XVII HD. Well, a two-page feature perhaps.
So here's the next issue of Retro Gamer with me as editor. I've split the magazine into sections dedicated to generations, with feature spreads throughout. Dedicated sections contain reviews, interviews, features, tips, trivia, etc. Each of the three cover features should be of interest to all. Just flick past the bits you're unfamiliar with - BUT! with each dedicated section packed with variety, you'll probably find at least a boxout or panel that catches your attention. You'll also notice the writing is more lively; irreverent; fun...
P1-3 COVER/ADSPACE
P4-5 CONTENTS SPREAD
P6-11 RETRO RADAR
P12 ADSPACE
P13 EDITORIAL/NEXT MONTH
P14-18 RETRO BEDROCK (FAUX TYPEWRITER/LATE 70s LINO)
P19 ADSPACE
P20-26 RETRO 8-BIT (CRASH/ZZAP BRANDING)
P27 ADSPACE
P28-33 COVER FEATURE 1
P34 ADSPACE
P35-39 CONTEMPORARY FEATURE
P40-41 HOUSE AD
P42-48 RETRO 16-BIT (THE ONE BRANDING)
P49 ADSPACE
P50-57 RETRO CART CITY (NES/SMS/GB/PCE/ETC.) (FAUX JAP. BRANDING)
P58-59 HOUSE AD
P60-65 COVER FEATURE 2
P66 ADSPACE
P67 COMPETITION! WIN SOMETHING FROM AN ADVERTISER!
P68-73 RETRO MEAN MACHINES (SNES/MD/ETC.) (MM BRANDING)
P74 ADSPACE
P75-80 COVER FEATURE 3
P81-88 RETRO NG CONSOLES (PS1-2/SAT/N64/ETC.) (CUSTOM BRANDING)
P89-90 FORUM
P91-92 ADSPACE/HOUSE AD
P93-97 RETRO NOW! HOMEBREW, NEW RELEASES, REVIEWS
P98 PREVIEWS/RETRO DIARY
P99 CLASSIFIEDS
P100-101 ADSPACE
* * *
(Still here?)
So there's my ideal RG. Should I get my way? NO! COMMERCIAL SUICIDE! In business-speak, such retrograde ghettoisation of an already niche title would stymie scaleability going forward thus eliminating potential leverage of the key demographic. Or something.
Nngh. I clearly haven't got the hang of this whole "explaining yourself clearly" thing yet. What I want personally from Retro Gamer, and what I personally think is good for the magazine, are two separate things.
No, I don't think that Retro Gamer should be entirely concerned with "8-bit British computer gaming of the 1980s for those that were there". But SURELY that was the very credo the magazine was built upon? I mean, I don't know... That certainly seemed to be the case when the mag was rescued from the ashes of Live Publishing. Back then, Retro Gamer was very much about preaching nostalgia to the already-converted. But even that era is "retro" now.
The mission statement these days? Well maybe it's more along the lines of "mass-market video game franchises with long lineage and (ideally) contemporary presence, peppered with farmed-out articles by and for the geeks". That pretty much sums up the contents of the magazine that continues to hit my doormat once a month. I refer you back to my original post for (yet more overly verbose) details on why I think that's a recipe for disaster.
What would I like personally? It's perfectly simple: wall-to-wall nostalgia. Not all of it aimed at me personally you understand, but for each generation to experience the same "wow, I'd forgotten that!" or "now here's something for me to get my teeth into" feeling as I would for the bits that interested me. So no more six-page glamour spreads of obscure consoles with a 5:50 copy/photo ratio. No more future classics or pages of fawning in-the-publisher's-pocket reviews of New Old Game XVII HD. Well, a two-page feature perhaps.
So here's the next issue of Retro Gamer with me as editor. I've split the magazine into sections dedicated to generations, with feature spreads throughout. Dedicated sections contain reviews, interviews, features, tips, trivia, etc. Each of the three cover features should be of interest to all. Just flick past the bits you're unfamiliar with - BUT! with each dedicated section packed with variety, you'll probably find at least a boxout or panel that catches your attention. You'll also notice the writing is more lively; irreverent; fun...
P1-3 COVER/ADSPACE
P4-5 CONTENTS SPREAD
P6-11 RETRO RADAR
P12 ADSPACE
P13 EDITORIAL/NEXT MONTH
P14-18 RETRO BEDROCK (FAUX TYPEWRITER/LATE 70s LINO)
P19 ADSPACE
P20-26 RETRO 8-BIT (CRASH/ZZAP BRANDING)
P27 ADSPACE
P28-33 COVER FEATURE 1
P34 ADSPACE
P35-39 CONTEMPORARY FEATURE
P40-41 HOUSE AD
P42-48 RETRO 16-BIT (THE ONE BRANDING)
P49 ADSPACE
P50-57 RETRO CART CITY (NES/SMS/GB/PCE/ETC.) (FAUX JAP. BRANDING)
P58-59 HOUSE AD
P60-65 COVER FEATURE 2
P66 ADSPACE
P67 COMPETITION! WIN SOMETHING FROM AN ADVERTISER!
P68-73 RETRO MEAN MACHINES (SNES/MD/ETC.) (MM BRANDING)
P74 ADSPACE
P75-80 COVER FEATURE 3
P81-88 RETRO NG CONSOLES (PS1-2/SAT/N64/ETC.) (CUSTOM BRANDING)
P89-90 FORUM
P91-92 ADSPACE/HOUSE AD
P93-97 RETRO NOW! HOMEBREW, NEW RELEASES, REVIEWS
P98 PREVIEWS/RETRO DIARY
P99 CLASSIFIEDS
P100-101 ADSPACE
* * *
(Still here?)
So there's my ideal RG. Should I get my way? NO! COMMERCIAL SUICIDE! In business-speak, such retrograde ghettoisation of an already niche title would stymie scaleability going forward thus eliminating potential leverage of the key demographic. Or something.
Sometimes you feel ancient when "retro" means the generations after you. I don't buy a retro magazine to feel ancient. I don't mind feeling old, but ancient is a bit too far. And Pokemon?
And I don't mean Pokemon as it is, a 15 year old game could be called retro too. But why all those DS and 3DS screenshots in the cover article? Or all those current-gen pokemon? Are DS and 3DS considered retro now? They could just have rebranded the magazine as "Current Gamer" now. :lol:
Although I absolutely have no problems with them being diversifying the contents of the magazine. Well we can diversify our buying habits too. :D
So here's the next issue of Retro Gamer with me as editor...
Nice. That sounds a lot more like a retro magazine than it is now. :)
Also I agree with you about them trying to get a larger audience by covering only obscure hardware. Isn't it obvious that if you want to have a larger audience then cover the more popular hardware?
And the revised Homebrew section... I used to buy the mag only for that part... Now I don't even read that section at all.
Basically I was saying all of the Makings ofs have started to sound the same. I used to read every word now I only read about 50%.
I have every issue since number 1 so I'm thinking of cancelling my subscription and starting to read them again from number 1. By the time I get through them all I'll have forgotten what's in the first so can start again. Like painting the Forth Bridge.
I always check back on my Making-ofs to try and ensure I haven't slipped into a pattern with them but it's not always easy as it depends on the material you have to work with of course. Tried to do something different with next month's one so let's see.
I always check back on my Making-ofs to try and ensure I haven't slipped into a pattern with them but it's not always easy as it depends on the material you have to work with of course. Tried to do something different with next month's one so let's see.
I can imagine that it can be very difficult to get different source material. There are only so many ways to write game. I'm looking forward to seeing next month's now.
Comments
I'm not going to answer that stupid question with an actual list of what is crap and what isn't. Just as many games on the Spectrum, C64, Amiga and other platforms are crap - because let's face it, not all games are great - the same goes for NES games too.
My games for the Spectrum: Dingo, The Speccies, The Speccies 2, Vallation, SQIJ.
Twitter: Sokurah
Until Retro Gamer came out, I honestly didn't know about emulators that you could just download! I'd seen those CD's of Speccy/C64?Amiga etc that you used to find in GAME and HMV, but I had no idea you could download it all yourself.
If it wasn't for that first magazine, I probably wouldn't have found here and I certainly wouldn't have discovered the joys of emulating MAME, Megadrive, SNES and so on. Those early issues always had emulators on the discs and small features on how to use them and it's where I learnt how to use many of the emulators that I still use today!
So yes, a decent feature on emulators would be a good idea. Infact, I'd like to see it becoming a regular feature each month, concentrating on one system at a time. Maybe with interviews with the people responsible for writing them and running through which ones are the best in terms of performance or features. MAME vs RAINE for example (if RAINE is still around?)
As for the magazine these days, yeah, it's not as good as it used to be. Infact, I'm starting to get bored with it as it seems to be covering the same things over and over, but I still buy it each month as I have a complete set, although, it's not all in the same place. I'm gonna have to dig around for them all!
I was in to emulators even before I even knew what it was. Back in the day when a friend and me had bought QL's we talked about writing an emulator so we could play Spectrum games on the QL. We never even started though - we didn't even know how to begin (we were coding 68000 though) but handling the Spectrum screen was a big theoretic hurdle in those pre-internet days. Thumbs up for those people brighter than us (ie: almost everyone) who managed it. :D
Knowing what I know now it should be possible but it would never have run at anyting even resembling the needed speed to be enjoyable.
A few years later I got the first "real" Spectrum emulator for my (then new) Amiga and had fun with that. That wasn't close to full speed either...but it still seemed like magic. :)
I have to agree but also comment that it wasn't always rosy red either. RG may not be "what it used to be" but try to go back to the beginning - they weren't all that good in the beginning (well, that's what I think every time I pull out the old issues, anyway). Massive props to Martyn Carroll for starting the whole thing up but things definitely improved once Darran took over. See, I'm not always being negative. :lol:
My games for the Spectrum: Dingo, The Speccies, The Speccies 2, Vallation, SQIJ.
Twitter: Sokurah
YOU have made it a stupid question by (deliberately?) misinterpreting the point being made.
Who said all (NES) games are great ? did I?
I said the classic games.
There might be some quibbling around the boundaries of what is and is not a classic; but there are games that are bonafide classics. That was the point.
Yes there are crap games on all systems. Just as many of the spectrum? Thousands more so, because of the ease of which low quality titles could be produced and distributed.
Hmm, I have to admit that I did notice the 'classic' part but conveniently (but not intentionally) forgot about that when I answered, so perhaps I was a bit too fast in answering. My mistake. ;)
My games for the Spectrum: Dingo, The Speccies, The Speccies 2, Vallation, SQIJ.
Twitter: Sokurah
Hold back on any praise though. This was the "original" Retro Gamer which, the current team will tell you, was amateurish and fanzine-like.
I've read about 5-10% of the last 20 issues or so. It's the only mag I buy and do so through nothing but habit. Reading a recent post where they discuss the mag's owners buying the Crash and Zzap 64 names I've decided to spend my ?5 a month on old issues of Crash, YS and Sinclair User.
/insert eyeroll here
I get to decide what constitutes crap to me...not you. That's not subjective. Opinion is ALWAYS subjective..that's why it's called opinion and not fact. Google "Opinion" if you are not sure of the definition...
EDIT: Here you go, I did it for you
o?pin?ion
əˈpinyən/
noun
noun: opinion; plural noun: opinions
a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
;)
Who said they were all crap? did I? ;)
Didn't they just cover a few issues back the resident evil remastered which are current gen releases...
Sorreee, I thought my comment was so absurdly stupid that it would be seen as intended - a comment on the repetitive closed loop of nostalgic journalism. Even on WoS we see the same subjects come up endlessly - I don't mind it one bit on here, but to try and sell that for real money without shaking it up is cul-de-sac stuff.
So probably Retro Gamer has to shake things up from time to time even if it alienates or doesn't work. Better to try it than to become a collector-only magazine.
Good on Retro Gamer, I say, for at least trying to exist into the bold new retro future. :???:
And as Beanz says the NES and Pokemon crap isn't crap at all to some Americans (or something along those lines)
Anyway, not my subject. NES games might not even all be crap for all I know. It understand that it is all əˈpinyən/
Perhaps Daz@Retrogamer could bravely pop up into the thread? Is he still going? I vaguely remember a flounce? C'mon Dazster!
Oh for gods sake shut up! Sound like 2 bloody 8 years olds!
Ex-Ocean Software graphic artist -
Download my FREE PDF 'LOAD DIJ DIJ' (180,000+ words): https://ko-fi.com/i/IG2G3BEJZP
ZX Art page: https://zxart.ee/eng/authors/m/mark-r-jones/
https://twitter.com/MarkRJones1970
https://www.facebook.com/OceanSoftwareLtd/
https://www.facebook.com/ultimateptg/
I like it and buy it, I fully understand the Spectrum content will be limited as the number of retro machines is huge and every machine that is superseded becomes retro but am grateful for the any Spectrum coverage.
Secondly, yes you could find a lot of content on the internet but I'm old and I like the physical aspect of Retro Gamer, I like to pick it up, flick through it, I lose interest in something far quicker if I'm reading it onscreen.
If you like it buy it, if you don't then don't bother, then everyone's happy...
somebody has a different opinion to the not-so-almightly Jones? heaven forbid.
This is a discussion forum isn't it? So why don't YOU shut up if you are not interested in this thread of the discussion.
You sound like a bloody grumpy old man!
http://www.worldofspectrum.org/forums/showpost.php?p=802296&postcount=121
Oh and you do realise you're not even discussing Retro Gamer anymore don't you...
I'm not sure what that link is trying to prove? That I asked what classic NES games are "crap"? That was a genuine point. The genuine point was, that the quality of a classic retro game (or art, or music, or literature) is independent of one person (or persons) thinking it is crap. There is a difference between objective (which a reviewer should attempt to acheive) and subjective (which a reviewer should try to avoid because a subjective, unqualified opinion, is of no use to anybody reading the review, unless of course, the reviewer has such a weight of experience that the reader can understand the sujectivism).
Retro gamer is not just about zx spectrum in particular, it is about retro games in general, so it seems a bit weird that there can be any complaint that it's content is exactly what it says on the cover.
As has been said, the same discussions come up on WOS all the time; which is understandable, given the limited life-span and limited number of truly classic games on spectrum. A magazine could not keep rehasing the same limited period and genre. Which IS the point of the discussion. I don't like Pokemon, I was too old for it when it came around. Does not make it crap. Millions bought it and enjoyed it. The characters and gameplay have stood the test of time. It was a classic retro game; on a classic retro machine (gameboy). Is it really suprising to see such a title in a retro magazine?
And yes, I do realise I was not discussing retro gamer; it seems to have moved into a quibble about who said this and who said that; a quibble which you have now included yourself in, and chose fit to extend, for some bizarre reason (antagonism?)
I don't agree or disagree with either of you. I was just pointing out how babyish you both sound having a petty argument in full view of everyone. And you then make yourself look even more immature by throwing in a 'hilarious' insult towards myself.
Grow up!
Ex-Ocean Software graphic artist -
Download my FREE PDF 'LOAD DIJ DIJ' (180,000+ words): https://ko-fi.com/i/IG2G3BEJZP
ZX Art page: https://zxart.ee/eng/authors/m/mark-r-jones/
https://twitter.com/MarkRJones1970
https://www.facebook.com/OceanSoftwareLtd/
https://www.facebook.com/ultimateptg/
A phrase came to mind when I saw that post "Desperately clutching at straws"...
yet you continue to involve yourself, and perpetuate, a "school ground argument?"
A phrase came to mind when I saw your post, "pot kettle black"...
yes dad
what is strange, is that you didn't like a particular post (or posts) and deemed yourself referee of what opinions are or are not worthy of discussion. Its petty, but you cannot help but get involved? Maybe you could say something constructive and bring the discussion around to your way of thinking without starting a pointless flame war over old computer games. Don't you see how "babyish" that is? You are free to disassociate yourself from a parts of a discussion that are too immature for you? All things in perspective, middle aged men arguing about the contents of a magazine that relives their childhood is not the best place to become a referee and decide who is being the most immature? Is it?
I'm commenting directly on the Retro Gamer debate. Nothing to do with your childish spate concerning crap NES games.
I've made one comment and it's fairly obvious the way it's worded that I'm not up for discussion about it. Just MY opinion.
Oh and don't try and be clever, you're not very good at it...
Ex-Ocean Software graphic artist -
Download my FREE PDF 'LOAD DIJ DIJ' (180,000+ words): https://ko-fi.com/i/IG2G3BEJZP
ZX Art page: https://zxart.ee/eng/authors/m/mark-r-jones/
https://twitter.com/MarkRJones1970
https://www.facebook.com/OceanSoftwareLtd/
https://www.facebook.com/ultimateptg/
You're dribbling on your keyboard...
Isn't that why the internet was invented?
Just use a tissue like the rest of us...
Nngh. I clearly haven't got the hang of this whole "explaining yourself clearly" thing yet. What I want personally from Retro Gamer, and what I personally think is good for the magazine, are two separate things.
No, I don't think that Retro Gamer should be entirely concerned with "8-bit British computer gaming of the 1980s for those that were there". But SURELY that was the very credo the magazine was built upon? I mean, I don't know... That certainly seemed to be the case when the mag was rescued from the ashes of Live Publishing. Back then, Retro Gamer was very much about preaching nostalgia to the already-converted. But even that era is "retro" now.
The mission statement these days? Well maybe it's more along the lines of "mass-market video game franchises with long lineage and (ideally) contemporary presence, peppered with farmed-out articles by and for the geeks". That pretty much sums up the contents of the magazine that continues to hit my doormat once a month. I refer you back to my original post for (yet more overly verbose) details on why I think that's a recipe for disaster.
What would I like personally? It's perfectly simple: wall-to-wall nostalgia. Not all of it aimed at me personally you understand, but for each generation to experience the same "wow, I'd forgotten that!" or "now here's something for me to get my teeth into" feeling as I would for the bits that interested me. So no more six-page glamour spreads of obscure consoles with a 5:50 copy/photo ratio. No more future classics or pages of fawning in-the-publisher's-pocket reviews of New Old Game XVII HD. Well, a two-page feature perhaps.
So here's the next issue of Retro Gamer with me as editor. I've split the magazine into sections dedicated to generations, with feature spreads throughout. Dedicated sections contain reviews, interviews, features, tips, trivia, etc. Each of the three cover features should be of interest to all. Just flick past the bits you're unfamiliar with - BUT! with each dedicated section packed with variety, you'll probably find at least a boxout or panel that catches your attention. You'll also notice the writing is more lively; irreverent; fun...
P1-3 COVER/ADSPACE
P4-5 CONTENTS SPREAD
P6-11 RETRO RADAR
P12 ADSPACE
P13 EDITORIAL/NEXT MONTH
P14-18 RETRO BEDROCK (FAUX TYPEWRITER/LATE 70s LINO)
P19 ADSPACE
P20-26 RETRO 8-BIT (CRASH/ZZAP BRANDING)
P27 ADSPACE
P28-33 COVER FEATURE 1
P34 ADSPACE
P35-39 CONTEMPORARY FEATURE
P40-41 HOUSE AD
P42-48 RETRO 16-BIT (THE ONE BRANDING)
P49 ADSPACE
P50-57 RETRO CART CITY (NES/SMS/GB/PCE/ETC.) (FAUX JAP. BRANDING)
P58-59 HOUSE AD
P60-65 COVER FEATURE 2
P66 ADSPACE
P67 COMPETITION! WIN SOMETHING FROM AN ADVERTISER!
P68-73 RETRO MEAN MACHINES (SNES/MD/ETC.) (MM BRANDING)
P74 ADSPACE
P75-80 COVER FEATURE 3
P81-88 RETRO NG CONSOLES (PS1-2/SAT/N64/ETC.) (CUSTOM BRANDING)
P89-90 FORUM
P91-92 ADSPACE/HOUSE AD
P93-97 RETRO NOW! HOMEBREW, NEW RELEASES, REVIEWS
P98 PREVIEWS/RETRO DIARY
P99 CLASSIFIEDS
P100-101 ADSPACE
* * *
(Still here?)
So there's my ideal RG. Should I get my way? NO! COMMERCIAL SUICIDE! In business-speak, such retrograde ghettoisation of an already niche title would stymie scaleability going forward thus eliminating potential leverage of the key demographic. Or something.
Still, at least I've got it out of my system, eh?
Get it written, I'll read that :D
And I don't mean Pokemon as it is, a 15 year old game could be called retro too. But why all those DS and 3DS screenshots in the cover article? Or all those current-gen pokemon? Are DS and 3DS considered retro now? They could just have rebranded the magazine as "Current Gamer" now. :lol:
Although I absolutely have no problems with them being diversifying the contents of the magazine. Well we can diversify our buying habits too. :D
Nice. That sounds a lot more like a retro magazine than it is now. :)
Also I agree with you about them trying to get a larger audience by covering only obscure hardware. Isn't it obvious that if you want to have a larger audience then cover the more popular hardware?
And the revised Homebrew section... I used to buy the mag only for that part... Now I don't even read that section at all.
Games List 2016 - Games List 2015 - Games List 2014
I wrote a bit of a rant about Retro Gamer on the Game Gavel forum about 18 months ago, see:
http://www.gamegavel.com/forum/showthread.php?t=6319
Basically I was saying all of the Makings ofs have started to sound the same. I used to read every word now I only read about 50%.
I have every issue since number 1 so I'm thinking of cancelling my subscription and starting to read them again from number 1. By the time I get through them all I'll have forgotten what's in the first so can start again. Like painting the Forth Bridge.
I can imagine that it can be very difficult to get different source material. There are only so many ways to write game. I'm looking forward to seeing next month's now.
Irony :lol: